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Tails

Anyone Worried About KH3's Developement?

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Yeah you lost me at "bad boss design". Sorry man, but those are some of my favorite bosses you're bashing there, you lost my interest and attention with this topic. If it's in their hands, I've got nothing BUT faith that this game will turn out well. Unless of course, that Rock Titan looked too "boring" to you, then I completely understand...not. I'm not normally this snarky, but you are literally calling something bad as if it were something that everyone should believe too, when it's very clear that it's just your opinion.  >.>

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I totally agree with you. The most frustrating thing for me was the floatiness of BBS, one example in particular being the fights in the tornadoes at the Keyblade Graveyard. They are so damn annoying when you get the one's with the giant unversed. And Vanitas? Don't even get me started. I try to get leveled up enough to where all I have to do is spam shotlock just so i don't have to mess with him.

 

To be honest though, more so than the gameplay, I worry about the storyline. It seems like any seriesI get into, they work really hard to build up a decent story and then when it comes time for the ending they're like "screw it! It's the end. Let's just rush and throw something quick together that sounds halfway decent. While gameplay mechanicsare VERY important, the thing I get more enjoyment from out of KH is the story. (No matter how crazy it can get at times).

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Yeah you lost me at "bad boss design". Sorry man, but those are some of my favorite bosses you're bashing there, you lost my interest and attention with this topic. If it's in their hands, I've got nothing BUT faith that this game will turn out well. Unless of course, that Rock Titan looked too "boring" to you, then I completely understand...not. I'm not normally this snarky, but you are literally calling something bad as if it were something that everyone should believe too, when it's very clear that it's just your opinion.  >.>

Well it is my opinion, haha. Sorry if I seemed too bashful :P. Wasn't saying that all the boss fights were horrible. Just a few that could have been better.

I totally agree with you. The most frustrating thing for me was the floatiness of BBS, one example in particular being the fights in the tornadoes at the Keyblade Graveyard. They are so damn annoying when you get the one's with the giant unversed. And Vanitas? Don't even get me started. I try to get leveled up enough to where all I have to do is spam shotlock just so i don't have to mess with him.To be honest though, more so than the gameplay, I worry about the storyline. It seems like any seriesI get into, they work really hard to build up a decent story and then when it comes time for the ending they're like "screw it! It's the end. Let's just rush and throw something quick together that sounds halfway decent. While gameplay mechanicsare VERY important, the thing I get more enjoyment from out of KH is the story. (No matter how crazy it can get at times).

Yeah, I hope they do a good job with the mechanics in KH3. Don't want everything to feel too floaty. As for story, eh they're fine for me except KH3D. Kinda hate the retcons and time travel element they put in there lol :P.

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Well it is my opinion, haha. Sorry if I seemed too bashful :P. Wasn't saying that all the boss fights were horrible. Just a few that could have been better.

Yeah, I hope they do a good job with the mechanics in KH3. Don't want everything to feel too floaty. As for story, eh they're fine for me except KH3D. Kinda hate the retcons and time travel element they put in there lol :P.

Well guess mine differs from yours then. I felt good about where BbS and DDD where and I feel confident with the same people making KH3.

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It should be fine since KH3 is going to be using the battle system from KH1 & 2 for the most part. This way there won't be a a chance to spam moves like fire surge for easy victories. I do agree with the fact that birth by sleep boss battles were utter garbage though.

Edited by Eternalsleep

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Well guess mine differs from yours then. I felt good about where BbS and DDD where and I feel confident with the same people making KH3.

Whoa easy there, pal. No need to get salty lol. We both have different opinions and we should just respect that (:.  I understand that you liked the boss fights, And that's completely fine. Not trying to make you feel bad about the bosses and what I said about them Again, my apologies.

Edited by Tails

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Whoa easy there, pal. No need to get salty lol. We both have different opinions and we should just respect that (:.  I understand that you liked the boss fights, And that's completely fine. Not trying to make you feel bad about the bosses and what I said about them Again, my apologies.

Yeah no worries there. I guess I just felt like it came off a bit strong. In any case though, I don't feel that there's as much for me to worry about with the next KH game as much as there is for me to worry about, say, the next Sonic game or something like that. I feel the games' quality has been consistent enough that I don't have much reason to worry anymore. That's just where I'm coming from. :)

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OK before ANYONE jumps the gun and thinks that I'm about to say something like "Oh do you think KH3 will take a long time to develope and come out in [insert year here]?". I'm not. What i want to discuss is the Osaka Team. Yes...the Osaka Team. As you have know, they are very horrible at making KH games in terms of boss battle designs and balancing out the games.  Oh come on! You know what I'm talking about! Just look at Birth by Sleep for example. HORRIBLE BOSS DESIGN RIGHT THERE! Just look at the Master Eraqus boss fight for example. That is really bad if you pay close attention to the boss fight. He will randomly teleport and hit you, even when you use an attack like aerial slam. And let's not forget the "great" Vanitas boss fights. The dude, for the majority of the battle, always teleports behind you saying "too slow" every time you even land at least two hits on him. Heck, sometimes it'll be just one hit and he'll teleport anyway. Those are one of the most horribly designed boss fights in the game. Even the optional bosses are horribly designed. You can kill Vanitas Lingering Remnant with only using...what...mine squares? I really wish there was more ways you could defeat him besides the mine squares And yes I know you can also use Tornado with Ven too but I mean kinda like in KH2/KH2FM. There are so many creative ways to defeat a boss/optional boss. I hope we can do that in KH3. That would be awesome. Also let's not forget the mess that is the Mysterious Figure. That is just a horribly made optional boss fight. There's hardly any openings you can use to attack him, all of his attacks pretty much one-shot you unless you have second chance/Once More, and the only way you can beat him is with Fire/Thunder Surge. That's pretty bad boss design if you ask me. And these are just a few of the bosses that are bad in KHBBS that I mentioned.KH3D also have these problems as well. Only except the MAJORITY OF THE BOSSES IN THAT GAME HARDLY EVER STAGGER. 

 

Now the next thing I want to talk about is game balancing. KH1 and especially KH2 had amazing balancing with attacks and stats. Everything wasn't overpowered but weren't weak either. It was just perfect. Especially in KH2FM's case. But when you look at Birth by Sleep and KH3D you just have to ask what went wrong. Especially in KH3D. In BBS Megaflare was overpowered to the point where they had to tweak in 3 times. Yes...3 TIMES! Same goes for KH3D with Balloon. The most overpowered and easily spammed command spell in the game (please tweak that in KH 2.8 please. Thanks.) And not to mention the lvl 1 runs in both KH BBS and KH3D. I mean holy crap their level 1 runs were not even worth it in the original versions of the games because you do chip damage. It's not even all that worth it or enjoyable for a challenge unless you like taking about 30 minutes to an hour or so trying to beat a boss with that crap damage. Glad they saw that and fixed in in KH 2.5 (and hopefully in KH 2.8 version of KH3D as well).

 

The point is. I really hope the Osaka team does a good job with balancing everything out in KH3. It's just like Aqua7KH said, KH3 HAS to be better than KH2 since it's the most anticipated and the next main installment of the KH series. I don't want any akward air attack animations (seriously the air animations in KH BBS and Kh3D are so akward and slow compared to KH1 and KH2's  air attack animations). I want bosses to have some staggering animations here and there and not make them not stagger at all like in KH3D or give them any ridiculous defense stats like with M=Armor of Eraqus in BBSFM.. And please no ovepowered attacks that will make fighting any bosses/any optional bosses feel cheap to win against. (looking at you Thundersurge, Megaflare, and Balloon). That ruins the experience of having a challenging boss fight in my opinion. This is why I'm glad that a few members of the KH Team will come and and help the Osaka Team with deleveping KH3. They actually KNOW how to make a perfectly balanced KH game. So yeah, just wanted to put my two cents out there. I kinda hate the Osaka Team when it come to them making KH games. They can do a bad job with it. Just look at KH 1.5 and 2.5. In KH 1.5 there ar glitches not present in the original KH1. And it's worse with KH Re: CoM because THEY DIDN'T BOTHER TO UPSCALE THE QUALITY OF CUTSCENES! Only the subtitles. Yup, they thought it was a good idea to just upscale the resolution on the subtitles and call it a "remaster" talk about lazy work. But I guess it's not as bad as the Silent Hill HD Collection. *looks at that collection and shivers*. And it's also bad in KH 2.5 where there are also glitches in dumb loading times with drive forms not present in the original KH2/KH2FM. Not sure about HD BBS since I haven't noticed any changes compared to the original version aside from balancing attack output out for the lvl 1 run. I hope the Osaka Team learned from their mistakes and don't give us all this bullcrap in KH3. This is what worries me about KH3's development.

 

But what do you all think? I know this is kind of a long post but like I said before I wanted to throw my two cents out there and share my opinion.

 

A TL;DR version from Soraalam1:

 

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I agree with you, even though the unbalanced battle systems in BBS and DDD is hilarious in my opinion. I just loved spamming balloon to the Julius optional boss battle in DDD just to get a good laugh at it. If they manage to balance out kingdom hearts 3 that's fine as long as the game's fun. 

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And this is why 0.2 Birth by Sleep: A Fragmentary Passage exists. It's the Kingdom Hearts III beta testing so that Kingdom Hearts III wouldn't have the "Osaka" predicaments.

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Bbs was fine. I didn't get much of a chance to use the OP attacks, but it was fun.. I never really had a crack at the optional bosses, but I've heard they're challenging.

Hell, I know that even though Vanitas Remnant will absolutely destroy me, even with my command deck of Mine Squares. It's not skill, but it ain't luck either. It takes a bit of both. I hope you don't see this as a bash to your comments, but more as a "my opinion" thing. I have high hopes in the Osaka team, and when FFXV devs join the fun, you can expect a polished Kingdom Hearts for the ages, 

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Yeah no worries there. I guess I just felt like it came off a bit strong. In any case though, I don't feel that there's as much for me to worry about with the next KH game as much as there is for me to worry about, say, the next Sonic game or something like that. I feel the games' quality has been consistent enough that I don't have much reason to worry anymore. That's just where I'm coming from. :)

Yeah I can definitely understand the Sonic games. SEGA's been rushing their games recently with Sonic. Hopefully they keep their word and take their time developing the next Sonic game.

A TL;DR version from Soraalam1:

 

Soraalam just summed up everything I said and more. I love it. Hopefully KH3's mechanics will be as great as KH2 or at least KH1.

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Could you imagine a 1000 heartless battle with Osaka's gameplay? It would be a pain.

 

With all my respect, I really think the Osaka Team don't know how to make character moves flow constantly, although I love BBS, every single normal attack was completely pointless and the thing I missed the most from other games were the abilites you gained to make your own and personalized combos. They kept the +1 combo and +1 air combo, but like I said before, BBS combos were so slow and "heavy" I didn't even care.

I agree! 

This issue is becoming more and more worrying, so what can we do as a community hmm? In a day and age where we can simply contact any gaming company.....

The best thing to do is to wait until the next trailer releases, if you feel the combos look floaty-then tweet Square Enix or the kingdom hearts twitter account and tell them. 0.2 will also be a good indicator of this, if it's unbalanced-then we should all tweet square enix and tell them. Politely of course.

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OK before ANYONE jumps the gun and thinks that I'm about to say something like "Oh do you think KH3 will take a long time to develope and come out in [insert year here]?". I'm not. What i want to discuss is the Osaka Team. Yes...the Osaka Team. As you have know, they are very horrible at making KH games in terms of boss battle designs and balancing out the games.  Oh come on! You know what I'm talking about! Just look at Birth by Sleep for example. HORRIBLE BOSS DESIGN RIGHT THERE! Just look at the Master Eraqus boss fight for example. That is really bad if you pay close attention to the boss fight. He will randomly teleport and hit you, even when you use an attack like aerial slam. And let's not forget the "great" Vanitas boss fights. The dude, for the majority of the battle, always teleports behind you saying "too slow" every time you even land at least two hits on him. Heck, sometimes it'll be just one hit and he'll teleport anyway. Those are one of the most horribly designed boss fights in the game. Even the optional bosses are horribly designed. You can kill Vanitas Lingering Remnant with only using...what...mine squares? I really wish there was more ways you could defeat him besides the mine squares And yes I know you can also use Tornado with Ven too but I mean kinda like in KH2/KH2FM. There are so many creative ways to defeat a boss/optional boss. I hope we can do that in KH3. That would be awesome. Also let's not forget the mess that is the Mysterious Figure. That is just a horribly made optional boss fight. There's hardly any openings you can use to attack him, all of his attacks pretty much one-shot you unless you have second chance/Once More, and the only way you can beat him is with Fire/Thunder Surge. That's pretty bad boss design if you ask me. And these are just a few of the bosses that are bad in KHBBS that I mentioned.KH3D also have these problems as well. Only except the MAJORITY OF THE BOSSES IN THAT GAME HARDLY EVER STAGGER. 

 

Now the next thing I want to talk about is game balancing. KH1 and especially KH2 had amazing balancing with attacks and stats. Everything wasn't overpowered but weren't weak either. It was just perfect. Especially in KH2FM's case. But when you look at Birth by Sleep and KH3D you just have to ask what went wrong. Especially in KH3D. In BBS Megaflare was overpowered to the point where they had to tweak in 3 times. Yes...3 TIMES! Same goes for KH3D with Balloon. The most overpowered and easily spammed command spell in the game (please tweak that in KH 2.8 please. Thanks.) And not to mention the lvl 1 runs in both KH BBS and KH3D. I mean holy crap their level 1 runs were not even worth it in the original versions of the games because you do chip damage. It's not even all that worth it or enjoyable for a challenge unless you like taking about 30 minutes to an hour or so trying to beat a boss with that crap damage. Glad they saw that and fixed in in KH 2.5 (and hopefully in KH 2.8 version of KH3D as well).

 

The point is. I really hope the Osaka team does a good job with balancing everything out in KH3. It's just like Aqua7KH said, KH3 HAS to be better than KH2 since it's the most anticipated and the next main installment of the KH series. I don't want any akward air attack animations (seriously the air animations in KH BBS and Kh3D are so akward and slow compared to KH1 and KH2's  air attack animations). I want bosses to have some staggering animations here and there and not make them not stagger at all like in KH3D or give them any ridiculous defense stats like with M=Armor of Eraqus in BBSFM.. And please no ovepowered attacks that will make fighting any bosses/any optional bosses feel cheap to win against. (looking at you Thundersurge, Megaflare, and Balloon). That ruins the experience of having a challenging boss fight in my opinion. This is why I'm glad that a few members of the KH Team will come and and help the Osaka Team with deleveping KH3. They actually KNOW how to make a perfectly balanced KH game. So yeah, just wanted to put my two cents out there. I kinda hate the Osaka Team when it come to them making KH games. They can do a bad job with it. Just look at KH 1.5 and 2.5. In KH 1.5 there ar glitches not present in the original KH1. And it's worse with KH Re: CoM because THEY DIDN'T BOTHER TO UPSCALE THE QUALITY OF CUTSCENES! Only the subtitles. Yup, they thought it was a good idea to just upscale the resolution on the subtitles and call it a "remaster" talk about lazy work. But I guess it's not as bad as the Silent Hill HD Collection. *looks at that collection and shivers*. And it's also bad in KH 2.5 where there are also glitches in dumb loading times with drive forms not present in the original KH2/KH2FM. Not sure about HD BBS since I haven't noticed any changes compared to the original version aside from balancing attack output out for the lvl 1 run. I hope the Osaka Team learned from their mistakes and don't give us all this bullcrap in KH3. This is what worries me about KH3's development.

 

But what do you all think? I know this is kind of a long post but like I said before I wanted to throw my two cents out there and share my opinion.

I am just going to cut to the chase. I skipped reading because seeing the length of it, I could tell something. In all honesty, I think you're being a worry wart. There is no need to worry about development for KH3. We have no control over it so why worry about something you have no control over? They will take their time and make sure to get it out as soon as possible while making sure to make everything as perfect and amazing as possible. Have faith they will come through and don't worry about something you have no control over. There are more important things in life to be worried about and KH3's development is NOT one of them.

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I am just going to cut to the chase. I skipped reading because seeing the length of it, I could tell something. In all honesty, I think you're being a worry wart. There is no need to worry about development for KH3. We have no control over it so why worry about something you have no control over? They will take their time and make sure to get it out as soon as possible while making sure to make everything as perfect and amazing as possible. Have faith they will come through and don't worry about something you have no control over. There are more important things in life to be worried about and KH3's development is NOT one of them.

I agree with that last sentence lol, I've said before that I'm concerned about the development a lot too and I know a lot of us are. But worrying won't make the time go faster, go play some other games, go outside, enjoy your life. There's plenty of awesome games to occupy you, expand your taste. 

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I am just going to cut to the chase. I skipped reading because seeing the length of it, I could tell something. In all honesty, I think you're being a worry wart. There is no need to worry about development for KH3. We have no control over it so why worry about something you have no control over? They will take their time and make sure to get it out as soon as possible while making sure to make everything as perfect and amazing as possible. Have faith they will come through and don't worry about something you have no control over. There are more important things in life to be worried about and KH3's development is NOT one of them.

I agree with KingdomHearts3 (lol). I am just glad that a Kingdom Hearts game is coming out to continue the series and complete the Xehanort Saga. I don't worry about the bosses or designs because it is the story that makes up and solidifies the game. I'm just glad that the series had been so successful and there has been this many games. Just enjoy the story and don't focus on the minor things. I'm sure they will iron them out and learned from their mistakes and are trying to make KH3 the best possible.

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I agree with that last sentence lol, I've said before that I'm concerned about the development a lot too and I know a lot of us are. But worrying won't make the time go faster, go play some other games, go outside, enjoy your life. There's plenty of awesome games to occupy you, expand your taste.

Precisely and by the way, what do we have to occupy us until E3 and why did we get it days ago?

I agree with KingdomHearts3 (lol). I am just glad that a Kingdom Hearts game is coming out to continue the series and complete the Xehanort Saga. I don't worry about the bosses or designs because it is the story that makes up and solidifies the game. I'm just glad that the series had been so successful and there has been this many games. Just enjoy the story and don't focus on the minor things. I'm sure they will iron them out and learned from their mistakes and are trying to make KH3 the best possible.

Why thank you for being that confident in me and my abilities! ;)

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Well, in all honesty, I didn't have a problem with Birth By Sleep and Dream Drop Distance, but I can understand your concerns about the floaty combos and slow pacing of fighting, because when comparing those games with KHI and KHII, the combat is very different!  But yeah, I have faith the Osaka team will do great with this game, and once the KH crew that were working on FFXV come to aid their talents to the game, the gameplay will get even better!  But yeah, like many here, what I care about most is the story!  Don't get me wrong, the gameplay is amazing and awesome as well, but I'm more into the games for their story! :3

 

Let's see how 0.2 fares out, and then we can more or less get an idea of how KHIII will be! :D

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Honestly, the one pro Osaka argument I have to make is that, in terms of story, we've seen some major improvements. Just with BBS and DDD alone, we've had more story development than any other game easily. I've noticed the team likes to focus a lot less on the whole Disney aspect of the games, which is fitting considering the audience that is still playing in the series.

 

However, the con that's really bothered me wasn't particularly with the bosses, but rather the leveling system. For whatever reason, in BBS and DDD I feel like leveling up was not paced correctly, often making boss battles seemingly more difficult than they really needed to be. I would spend hours on these two games grinding for levels just to beat small boss battles, when in KH1/KH2 it wasn't as challenging to try and get by without leveling up significantly.

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