My big Kh theory; Xehanort is going to turn Sora into Vanitas: 

 

I predict that the entire aim of Xehanort in all his schemes recently is to recreate not only the Xblade but the one experiment that was closest to achieving that end. That experiment being Vanitas, that guy that looks disturbingly similar to Sora. How are they going to bring Vanitas back? By turning Sora into him. In fact that has been their entire aim since Chain Of Memories all the way to Dream Drop Distance. 

 

Now I know the refutes for this theory are as follows. Vanitas co existed with Sora so Sora is not Vanitas. 

 

However its far more complicated then that. Lets start at the very beginning of Vanitas's birth. He was getting sucked out of Ventus when Sora's newborn heart floated in and interacted with the two of them, healing Ventus and (my belief anyway) giving some of Sora's darkness in his stronger heart to Vanitas and thus making his appearance the dominant one even though he was supposed to be made from Ventus. 

So this mean Vanitas and Sora were born at the same time even though one was full grown and one was a newborn baby. It also means that if I'm right That Sora was not entirely whole when he was born, meaning he was missing a lot of the darkness in his heart which may explain why he is so happy all the time. So in a sense Sora and to a lesser extent Ventus were the light half and Vanitas was the dark half of two hearts. 

Then after Stuff goes down in Birth By Sleep Ventus and Vanitas reunite four years later and Ventus has to recuperate inside Sora. Ventus had none of his memories at this point although I'm not sure the same could be said of Vanitas, but at that point Sora's heart and persona was the most dominant. Like Roxas said in BBB it could of gone differently and Roxas could of chosen to become the dominant persona but "it had to be Sora" instead. 

 

Its all about Persona's and which is the most dominant. Like Riku and Ansem were fighting for dominance or when Xehanort and Terra was doing the same, Sora instead of contending with one extra persona and heart has many he has had to handle over the course of his life, though most have been incapacitated or memory wiped in one way or another. The have made hints to this dichotomy throughout the game and it left me with the question, what if an aggressive persona tried for Sora?

 

As Xemnas said "Memory and the heart are tightly related"

 

That is what a persona is. A collection of memories and decisions that make a person who they are. You take away those memories and the recollection of these decisions and then the persona is no more and can be rewritten, much like the Tron arc in dream drop distance. So the question is if I'm right and if they have been trying to bring Vanitas's persona and form out of Sora, have they been trying to attack Sora's memories and decisions? 

 

Anyone who has played the games can answer this with a resounding yes. 

 

At first Ansem, Xehanorts heartless, wanted to turn Riku into the Surrogate Vanitas. This is why he had Vanitas's uniform, his fighting stance, and why he was so chill when the darkness swallowed destiny Islands in the first game. He was trained and prepared for that to happen. We all know how that apprenticeship worked out, Ansem took over his body when he thought he was prepped enough and then he was eventually defeated and dominated by Sora and then Riku. Riku's heart and Persona were so dominant that he could hold Ansem's form and retain control. 

 

However When Sora released Kairi with Riku Ansem's dark keyblade he also released his nobody, previously memory wiped Ventus became Roxas and Kairi's Namine came into existence. Sora for a brief period of time became a shadow, but do to Kairi hugging him and her heart being inside him for so long, she was able to reboot his persona. Like Ansem Seeker of Darkness he was able to retain a human shape even though he was a heartless and remained a heartless until at least kh2. 

 

Without Sora's body and the other persona's buffering him from Vanitas he was much more vulnerable to being taken over during that period of time. This is what Castle Oblivion and 358/2 days was all about; Wiping his memories and his persona to rebirth Vanitas. However there was two different schools of thought over how it should be done in Organization 13. One group thought Vanitas should be born in Castle Oblivion and Xemnas and his people believed that it would be better to have Vanitas transferred into a Replica known as Xion. 

 

They thought Xion a failure though because of the fact that she was siphoning off residual memories of Kairi from her time inside Sora and thus taking on her appearance until those memories were fully downloaded and she started siphoning off Sora's persona. Xion in her desperation had Roxas Destroy her before she became Vanitas, stopping it at an armored Sora nobody thing. Namine similarly stopped Vanitas from coming out by Putting Sora to sleep to "help him heal" while that was a nicer way of saying stop him from going bad on them.

 

During Kh2 one of the features of the Drives was Sora going Anti-sora when you abused the system. It should be noted that the black form and gold eyes not only resemble a shadow but Vanitas as well (kind of a stretch but I like it). During Dream drop distance Xehanort in all his forms alluded to the fact that Sora wasn't what he thought he was, that he should "check if the contents resemble whats on the label", and that he was the key to their plans to come into being. For them to recreate the Xblade. For them to recreate Vanitas.  

 

What this could mean for Kh3:

 

I believe that for a time in Kh3 they will succeed and that Sora will be turned into Vanitas. I believe that Riku and probably Kairi and others will have to come and deal with the Sora/Vanitas, and give him speeches about friendship and all that Jazz, do a boss battle that strikingly resemble the fight between Riku and Sora from Kh1 but role reversed, and all the emotional turmoil that will come from having the happiest character in Kingdom Hearts go evil. 

 

It won't be for long: 

 

Such a thing like this will be short lived though, he will not be stuck that way for long and it will probably end with an internal battle between Sora and Vanitas in that Stain glass world we are always seeing. At which point Sora will win and become his good old self again. 

 

This theory of mine has been in the making for a long while but I have not seen everything to be completely sure, however I think it will be an awesome twist to the game if they do it like this. What do you think? 

Awesome theory! Are there theories you have?

I think it's an interesting theory, and clearly you worked hard, since you have many arguments. But I see two problems with it:

1- Another way to get the X-Blade: Well, unless Xehanort was lying about his new "proper way" to make the X-Blade, Vanitas is the key to obtaing it. But he could be one of 13 Darkness.

 

2- And from what it looks, Sora is playable character in the game. KH3 would have to be like BbS, with more tha one playable character. And the other problem I see with that is, being a numbered title, Nomura seems to prefer to keep some kind of tradition. I hope he makes an exception for this though, I'd love to play with other characters, and they all having a big story, unlike BbS and KH3D, where they were rather small.

 

But really, there's nothing wrong with your theory, and it makes a lot of sense. I wouldn't be surprised if they were to use it

I think it's an interesting theory, and clearly you worked hard, since you have many arguments. But I see two problems with it:

1- Another way to get the X-Blade: Well, unless Xehanort was lying about his new "proper way" to make the X-Blade, Vanitas is the key to obtaing it. But he could be one of 13 Darkness.

 

2- And from what it looks, Sora is playable character in the game. KH3 would have to be like BbS, with more tha one playable character. And the other problem I see with that is, being a numbered title, Nomura seems to prefer to keep some kind of tradition. I hope he makes an exception for this though, I'd love to play with other characters, and they all having a big story, unlike BbS and KH3D, where they were rather small.

 

But really, there's nothing wrong with your theory, and it makes a lot of sense. I wouldn't be surprised if they were to use it

For number one I don't see how it conflicts with the theory, if anything it helps it. 

 

For number two I'd say that they are already prepping for a multi character arc since nearly every side game featured multiple playable characters. So The Sora arc could end with him getting turned, much like in Birth By Sleep. 

 

And yes its been on my brain for many years...many...many years. The new stuff just fit into the theory nicely. 

For number one I don't see how it conflicts with the theory, if anything it helps it. 

 

For number two I'd say that they are already prepping for a multi character arc since nearly every side game featured multiple playable characters. So The Sora arc could end with him getting turned, much like in Birth By Sleep. 

 

And yes its been on my brain for many years...many...many years. The new stuff just fit into the theory nicely. 

Oh, it's just you mentioned he was the key to making the new X-Blade. I just think he's a part of it, one of the 13 Darkness.

 

The thing is, they want to use some ideas from the side game in the numbered titles, but Nomura doesn't to change the latter very much. Same idea of "commands" instead of decks, and pretty much Sora as leading. So i'm a little uncertain at this. Though Nomura could consider most of the fans want to play as other heroes.

 

That's awesome! Which probably makes it right

The main problem I have with the whole concept of bringing back Vanitas is that Xehanort said in DDD that he spent a lot of time weeding out the weak and failures of  the old Organization. So I'm not sure why he would want Vanitas back, considering he was an abject failure on multiple levels. 

The main problem I have with the whole concept of bringing back Vanitas is that Xehanort said in DDD that he spent a lot of time weeding out the weak and failures of  the old Organization. So I'm not sure why he would want Vanitas back, considering he was an abject failure on multiple levels. 

 

He was referring to Organization XIII, Vanitas was not part of that (unless you count the whole Xion thing) 

Sorry that I'm a bit late to talk about this...(about 2 years)

 

I absolutely LOVE this theory!!! 

 

But I would like to back your theory up on this one as well as debunk a few things. It could probably been thought of before me too. *Spoiler Alert for returning viewers*

 

 

The thought of Xemnas and Ansem repeatedly trying to recreate Vanitas throughout KHI - II by using whatever resources used at the time AND Sora is incredibly well thought out, considering that Xehanort literally planned this all ahead...using his own methods...it almost seems like he KNEW that all of this was going to happen... *Looks suspiciously at a locked Tome of Prophecy*

 

I think Vanitas could definitely be one of the XIII. Just seeing him in DDD just makes it seem convincing enough. It's almost like Sora actually saw him at that point in time like some kind of screwed up hallucination...except it probably wasn't...

 

I don't think that Sora would turn into Vanitas DIRECTLY, however, as Xehanort would only want Sora's Darkness for his ranks, and knowing that Sora has a lot of light to give would make him a default candidate for a Guardian of Light, obviously, and the only way that Vanitas would be brought back in the first place, is if the same thing that happened to Ventus happened to Sora.

 

At the very beginning of BbS, an unconscious Ven was spliced into two. One being Ventus, and all of his light, and Vanitas, the being of Darkness formed with Sora's persona. When Sora was born, his heart was fused with Ventus, which led to Vanitas resembling Sora. That much was the truth from the beginning, however, when you think about it, at the end of BbS, a young Sora felt sad due to Ventus' heart being broken, causing said heart of Ventus to retreat back to Sora as a result, (sort of a "I scratch your back, you scratch mine" sort of deal) and if the beginning of KHII is correct we know that Sora wakes up from a nap that restored his memories. This would cause Ven's heart to in turn restore faster combined with his sleeping... and when the time comes Sora can give Ven his heart back, and fill his heart completely...even the darkness. This could probably cause Xehanort to perform the same "splitting effect" to Ven AGAIN sometime during KHIII causing Vanitas's Resurrection. 

 

Xehanort would exploit Ven's darkness, allowing him to splice away the Darkness once more to form a new Vanitas. Easy peasy, especially if he did it once already. It would explain why Ven's Armor protected Sora in DDD, his heart is restored to a point where he can send his armor to help protect Sora's heart like some kind of firewall!!!. Somewhere in anyone's heart is Darkness, (as we learned from a handful of characters, most inspiring being Mickey's point of view, being that we can't live without either element) Sora and I'm sure Ven before Xehanort's actions, were never looking toward hate or negativity to a stand point, meaning that they have Darkness in themselves, but they are willing to do whatever it takes to not let the darkness win. The same could be said about Riku, at last glance, considering that he was supposed to be the original replacement for Vanitas, at first, but he developed a resistance, so he was moved down the list. Roxas was also another candidate, considering that he IS Ventus as a shell, but as said, he became too aware of his own origin, and he returned to Sora. Similarly for Xion, initially being Kairi's Memories with Sora, would make her an extremely failed attempt because Xion was becoming more closer toward the light, being the case with Kairi's memories. 

 

But the fact that Vanitas still lives on to this day...what would he look like this time? Well...considering that Ven's heart is still in Sora, and the fact that Darkness will probably include that of Roxas's pain,...

 

Oddly enough, he would look like Ventus (Or Aqua's final fight with Vanitas) due to the Persona Rule explained with why Vanitas in BbS looked like Sora. Because when Ventus' heart shattered, it didn't necessarily disappear, it just went to find a new home by sleeping, much like when Sora slept..and woke up in KHII...and going to sleep AGAIN in DDD . That's the significance in the title that is the prequl. We are all born by sleeping. And we will be reborn, when we are done sleeping...including the darkness, as it must return somehow...

 

 

 

In conclusion... 

 

I believe your theory is correct. Vanitas will most definitely be coming back as part of The XIII Seekers of Darkness.  And he will look like Ventus, with a side of hidden Roxas Rage.

 

 

 

By ressurecction of his own mutual ashes,,,

 

 

 

With that being said, there are still a few questions left still unanswered. It still seems like we don't know much about Ventus, Aqua, and Terra's origins. If Xehanort found Ventus then where exactly did he find him? We may know that Aqua and Terra were taken in by Eraqus, but we don't even know where they came either! The same goes for Riku, Kairi and Sora!!! We know NOTHING about their origins. They must come from...somewhere...Sora's Mother Proves this!

 

 

Hmm..but......something else is bugging me...even more...

 

 

In another unrelated thought that I had, what if Xehanort didn't truly kill Master Eraqus? Instead of fading into light (dying) he could very well would've known how to achieve time travel, and go back to the past to find someone who can help him find his pupils? Hmm...

http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--ZcPRRGLc--/c_fit,fl_progressive,q_80,w_636/763684851294812995.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

Sorry that I'm a bit late to talk about this...(about 2 years)

 

I absolutely LOVE this theory!!! 

 

But I would like to back your theory up on this one as well as debunk a few things. It could probably been thought of before me too. *Spoiler Alert for returning viewers*

 

 

The thought of Xemnas and Ansem repeatedly trying to recreate Vanitas throughout KHI - II by using whatever resources used at the time AND Sora is incredibly well thought out, considering that Xehanort literally planned this all ahead...using his own methods...it almost seems like he KNEW that all of this was going to happen... *Looks suspiciously at a locked Tome of Prophecy*

 

I think Vanitas could definitely be one of the XIII. Just seeing him in DDD just makes it seem convincing enough. It's almost like Sora actually saw him at that point in time like some kind of screwed up hallucination...except it probably wasn't...

 

I don't think that Sora would turn into Vanitas DIRECTLY, however, as Xehanort would only want Sora's Darkness for his ranks, and knowing that Sora has a lot of light to give would make him a default candidate for a Guardian of Light, obviously, and the only way that Vanitas would be brought back in the first place, is if the same thing that happened to Ventus happened to Sora.

 

At the very beginning of BbS, an unconscious Ven was spliced into two. One being Ventus, and all of his light, and Vanitas, the being of Darkness formed with Sora's persona. When Sora was born, his heart was fused with Ventus, which led to Vanitas resembling Sora. That much was the truth from the beginning, however, when you think about it, at the end of BbS, a young Sora felt sad due to Ventus' heart being broken, causing said heart of Ventus to retreat back to Sora as a result, (sort of a "I scratch your back, you scratch mine" sort of deal) and if the beginning of KHII is correct we know that Sora wakes up from a nap that restored his memories. This would cause Ven's heart to in turn restore faster combined with his sleeping... and when the time comes Sora can give Ven his heart back, and fill his heart completely...even the darkness. This could probably cause Xehanort to perform the same "splitting effect" to Ven AGAIN sometime during KHIII causing Vanitas's Resurrection. 

 

Xehanort would exploit Ven's darkness, allowing him to splice away the Darkness once more to form a new Vanitas. Easy peasy, especially if he did it once already. It would explain why Ven's Armor protected Sora in DDD, his heart is restored to a point where he can send his armor to help protect Sora's heart like some kind of firewall!!!. Somewhere in anyone's heart is Darkness, (as we learned from a handful of characters, most inspiring being Mickey's point of view, being that we can't live without either element) Sora and I'm sure Ven before Xehanort's actions, were never looking toward hate or negativity to a stand point, meaning that they have Darkness in themselves, but they are willing to do whatever it takes to not let the darkness win. The same could be said about Riku, at last glance, considering that he was supposed to be the original replacement for Vanitas, at first, but he developed a resistance, so he was moved down the list. Roxas was also another candidate, considering that he IS Ventus as a shell, but as said, he became too aware of his own origin, and he returned to Sora. Similarly for Xion, initially being Kairi's Memories with Sora, would make her an extremely failed attempt because Xion was becoming more closer toward the light, being the case with Kairi's memories. 

 

But the fact that Vanitas still lives on to this day...what would he look like this time? Well...considering that Ven's heart is still in Sora, and the fact that Darkness will probably include that of Roxas's pain,...

 

Oddly enough, he would look like Ventus (Or Aqua's final fight with Vanitas) due to the Persona Rule explained with why Vanitas in BbS looked like Sora. Because when Ventus' heart shattered, it didn't necessarily disappear, it just went to find a new home by sleeping, much like when Sora slept..and woke up in KHII...and going to sleep AGAIN in DDD . That's the significance in the title that is the prequl. We are all born by sleeping. And we will be reborn, when we are done sleeping...including the darkness, as it must return somehow...

 

 

 

In conclusion... 

 

I believe your theory is correct. Vanitas will most definitely be coming back as part of The XIII Seekers of Darkness.  And he will look like Ventus, with a side of hidden Roxas Rage.

 

 

 

By ressurecction of his own mutual ashes,,,

 

 

 

With that being said, there are still a few questions left still unanswered. It still seems like we don't know much about Ventus, Aqua, and Terra's origins. If Xehanort found Ventus then where exactly did he find him? We may know that Aqua and Terra were taken in by Eraqus, but we don't even know where they came either! The same goes for Riku, Kairi and Sora!!! We know NOTHING about their origins. They must come from...somewhere...Sora's Mother Proves this!

 

 

Hmm..but......something else is bugging me...even more...

 

 

In another unrelated thought that I had, what if Xehanort didn't truly kill Master Eraqus? Instead of fading into light (dying) he could very well would've known how to achieve time travel, and go back to the past to find someone who can help him find his pupils? Hmm...

 

http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--ZcPRRGLc--/c_fit,fl_progressive,q_80,w_636/763684851294812995.jpg

 

He's not going to look like Ventus if he comes back...Why would he? Wrong. Plus he's even voiced by Haley...(Sora). And it showed him as Sora in DDD. That would be lame, anyways. It wouldn't be Vanitas anymore. I'm pretty sure he's going to possess Sora somehow. In fact, it's almost a given, thinking about how amazing it would be. I'd actually be pissed if it didn't happen.

Edited March 26, 201510 yr by Winchester

i love this theory i think this should definitely happen

Yeah yeah, I know this is like two years old but since this topic recently popped up in the KH3 section there's a detail that I'd like to add to debunk your theory. (sorry)

 

for one, I believe that you've misunderstood that final battle between Ventus and Vanitus at the end of BBS. They didn't reunite in the end. Hell no, if that happened then the X blade would have been completely forged and all hell would break loose. Ventus destroyed Vanitus along with the X blade. Because of this, his heart broke since he destroyed his dark side and the X blade which also had fragments of Ven's light within it. So with that evidence, it can be seen that Vanitus is gone and has been such for a long while. And that evidence in itself keeps Vanitus from ever coming in contact with Sora's heart. Sure there was the connection with the appearance but that was only because of the sync that him and Ventus's hearts had. Sure that short cameo in DDD would seem to be disproving of my evidence, but that was, as Nomura said, Ventus's reaction to Xehanort's darkness and making a hypothetical connection to his long gone dark self. 

 

and another point you've seem to misunderstand is what you said here about the reason Vanitas looks like Sora:

 

"However its far more complicated then that. Lets start at the very beginning of Vanitas's birth. He was getting sucked out of Ventus when Sora's newborn heart floated in and interacted with the two of them, healing Ventus and (my belief anyway) giving some of Sora's darkness in his stronger heart to Vanitas and thus making his appearance the dominant one even though he was supposed to be made from Ventus. 

So this mean Vanitas and Sora were born at the same time even though one was full grown and one was a newborn baby. It also means that if I'm right That Sora was not entirely whole when he was born, meaning he was missing a lot of the darkness in his heart which may explain why he is so happy all the time. So in a sense Sora and to a lesser extent Ventus were the light half and Vanitas was the dark half of two hearts. "

 

Vanitas was born when Xehanort separated Ven's darkness from his light right? But you're saying that while that was occurring, Sora's newborn heart randomly was floating around in the Keyblade Graveyard and interacted with Ven and Vanitus. That doesn't make any sense at all. For one, I could go as far as to say that Sora wasn't even born yet. But I have no access to Sora's technical birthdate in the timeline so I'll just throw out there that Destiny Islands, and the Keyblade Graveyard are two completely separate worlds. Sora's heart, even as young and rambunctious as it was, would have no reason to go out wandering between worlds for some vague reason.

 

Oh and to add an extra detail, the reason why Sora is so happy go lucky remains the reason that was stated in DDD's ending: because he embraced the childlike innocence of the heart and kept that with him even as he grew up. 

 

Let me explain the actual process here. 

 

Xehanort vacuums out Ven's darkness and that darkness becomes a sentient independent being of pure darkness. Because everyone's heart has a dark side, Ven basically loses half of his heart and his heart is literally 'broken'. Xehanort drags Ven alongside him to different worlds etc until one night for some reason that hasn't been explained yet, Xehanort leaves Ven's body lying on a palm tree on the destiny Islands for a short time. During that time is when Sora first interacts with Ven's heart. Ven borrows some of Sora's light, thanks him and then awakens with his heart, now of pure light, restored. So I guess we can call him a PRINCESS OF HEART NOW EH?

 

Now allow me to explain what happened in between the lines. (I'm sorry, I'm not sure if this is canon, but I remember reading something in an interview and discussed this with a friend and we agreed that it was canon)

 

The case of Vanitas is a bit similar to Xion's. When Vanitas was first born, he has no face similar to Xion when she was first created. (Or maybe he had a face that was totally different or something we probably won't know unless it's in an interview I haven't read yet whatever it isn't important.) Ven and Vanitas clearly have a connection even when they're separated. They're halves of a whole and because this is Kingdom Hearts that is a pretty solid connection. Ven takes in a part of Sora's light. So now Ven has a part of Sora within his heart. This in turn because of Vanitas's connection with Ven causes Vanitas's face to change into a Sonic OC like re-palette of Sora's older face. Why older face? Because Ven is a teen after all. Like I said before, the situation is similar to Xion's. They both start out with no faces, and then via a connection (the connection between Van and Ven/Xion interacting with Roxas and Roxas being Sora's nobody) they gain a face. You get my point here? 

 

(Though I find it as an amazing coincidence that both Vanitas and Xion both have black hair)

 

And another point to mention, what evidence do you have to support that Ventus lost his memories after his fight with his dark side? The reason he's in a comatose state is because his heart is broken (again). I understand if you give me evidence that Roxas had Ven's heart within him but didn't have Ven's memories but I think that it's pretty solid that (not technically canon yet) that Ven's heart was lying dormant within Roxas. Memories included. 

 

All in all, your theory was quite developed and I applaud you for such a theory. It's just that sadly the foundations of that theory were flawed. 

Edited March 27, 201510 yr by khdayskh1314