So in the atlantica level of the game king triton speaks as if he knows a lot about the boundaries of worlds and how they're set up. my question is why and how does he know about the keyblade and the keyholes. and since he knew sora was a keyblade wielder why didn't he just help immediately instead of waiting until his trident was stolen and his kingdom was in even more parel.

 

this is just one of the many things that caught my attention during my nostalgic play through and since i didn't see a plot thread stickied or anything i thought it would be appropriate to have an all around plot hole thread to discuss... well plot holes.

Just a couple of INB4's before we get started

>inb4 KH wasn't supposed to have a sequel

>inb4 It's just a game

these aren't valid arguments as a lot of the themes and ideals of the game appear in later games meaning that nomura had to have used most of the events of kingdom hearts 1 to make 2. also a lot of the KH1 exposition from characters lines up with whatever happened in Birth by sleep meaning that nomura wasn't making all of it up as it went.

now that that is out of the way, any thoughts?

 

Errr... wat? 

One: its likely to assume that since Leon and the others knew about it, that there were other Keyblade Wielders. Since there are also legend about it, its safe to assume that there are previous Keyblade wielders. The possibility that in the past Triton encountered a wielder previously. Also, he didn't know his kingdom was in trouble from Ursula, and knew Keyblade weilders can cause trouble.

Fool. Triton probably didn't help Sora because he didn't know the situation. How was he suppose to know that the worlds were on the verge of being thrown to darkness.

 

I could definitely see Kingdom Hearts being a stand alone game. Nothing during the game necessarily needed to be carried over. At the end of 1, they could of just had Sora go to Destiny Islands and live happily ever after.

Edited November 27, 201311 yr by MasterXemnas

One: its likely to assume that since Leon and the others knew about it, that there were other Keyblade Wielders. Since there are also legend about it, its safe to assume that there are previous Keyblade wielders. The possibility that in the past Triton encountered a wielder previously. Also, he didn't know his kingdom was in trouble from Ursula, and knew Keyblade weilders can cause trouble.

1. but how did leon know about keyblade wielders when according to him the world was taken by darkness 9 years prior to the first game, when the only weilder left was king mickey who from what i saw in birth by sleep was only average.also triton is the king of the seas, so why wouldnt he know that there were heartless roaming around in his domain. also, triton is aware that sora saved her daughter. why then would he assume that sora was no more than a trouble maker?

 

Fool. Triton probably didn't help Sora because he didn't know the situation. How was he suppose to know that the worlds were on the verge of being thrown to darkness.

 

I could definitely see Kingdom Hearts being a stand alone game. Nothing during the game necessarily needed to be carried over. At the end of 1, they could of just had Sora go to Destiny Islands and live happily ever after.

Fool. Triton, being the king of his domain should at least be aware about what's going on in it. and he is aware that there are heartless in his world so why wouldn't he know that AT LEAST his world was on the brink of being swallowed by darkness? especially since he seems to know something about key wielders and their duties.

1. but how did leon know about keyblade wielders when according to him the world was taken by darkness 9 years prior to the first game, when the only weilder left was king mickey who from what i saw in birth by sleep was only average.also triton is the king of the seas, so why wouldnt he know that there were heartless roaming around in his domain. also, triton is aware that sora saved her daughter. why then would he assume that sora was no more than a trouble maker?

 

Fool. Triton, being the king of his domain should at least be aware about what's going on in it. and he is aware that there are heartless in his world so why wouldn't he know that AT LEAST his world was on the brink of being swallowed by darkness? especially since he seems to know something about key wielders and their duties.

Maybe he had an off~day? 

Maybe he had an off~day? 

care to elaborate?

 

 

 

Fool. Triton, being the king of his domain should at least be aware about what's going on in it. and he is aware that there are heartless in his world so why wouldn't he know that AT LEAST his world was on the brink of being swallowed by darkness? especially since he seems to know something about key wielders and their duties.

Fool. Heartless aren't a common thing, so he might not know completely what that means. Plus, anyone can turn into a heartless, seeing one doesn't spell out why it would be there. Keyblade wielders are known, after the war, to keep the light in balance, not just taking out heartless. Triton telling Sora not to meddle to shows that king Triton is not aware of what is going on and does not know Sora is fulfilling his duties. He probably also knows that there isn't really a whole lot of masters, and Sora is just a kid, so he probably ould not have the task of saving the worlds.

That's not a plothole. That's an unaddressed issue. 

He seemed to be under the assumption that a keyblade weilder would make the people/merfolk whatever aware that there are other world which in turn would attract more heartless (isn't that how it works or am i wrong).  Also I think he was afraid that Sora might steal the world's heart.

my question is why and how does he know about the keyblade and the keyholes.

Considering the number of keyblade weilders there once was and how the worlds all used to be connected as one, it can be assumed that some of the people around during that time passed the information down their heritage, the way Kairi's Granmother said it to her as a child.  As not only a citizen of Atlantica, but the King (and technically a God) of the city it would be justified for him to know about something that set the history of his world

.  

and since he knew sora was a keyblade wielder why didn't he just help immediately instead of waiting until his trident was stolen and his kingdom was in even more parel.

Again as a leader who knows that there should be no meddling in other worlds he most likely thought Sora shouldn't be meddling in his world and so shouldn't help him cause trouble.  He also didn't know Sora or his true intentions so it's expected to be suspicious.  You wouldn't help someone to break the rules that everyone who know about the war and keyblades were well aware of - "Don't meddle with the affairs of other worlds".  He really ends up resorting to Sora as a last choice when he ran out of options and needed to save his world.  After that he see's that Sora is really on his side.  Additionally, we saw him just blasting away the heartless with his trident at the palace, he was clearly capable of handling it , thinking these weak minded enemies were just swarming his ocean, not being lead and controlled by Ursula.  

Edited November 27, 201311 yr by Caity Raindrop

He was afraid that Sora might put Ariel in danger and probably didn't want any keyblade welders to enter his world because it'll risk the world in danger of the heartless. See what brings the heartless is the keyblade. They're after the keyblade. As to how he knows, its probably because he's a king/god, they have a vast knowledge, or he had an artifact indicating the keyblades existence. You know how Ariel have a cave full of artifacts from the human world that dropped under the sea? Maybe something fell in the ocean that King Triton found and was stolen by Ursula. Ansem report pehaps?

 

Yes it's more likely. If I recall right, you do get a report after defeating her.

Fool. Heartless aren't a common thing, so he might not know completely what that means. Plus, anyone can turn into a heartless, seeing one doesn't spell out why it would be there. Keyblade wielders are known, after the war, to keep the light in balance, not just taking out heartless. Triton telling Sora not to meddle to shows that king Triton is not aware of what is going on and does not know Sora is fulfilling his duties. He probably also knows that there isn't really a whole lot of masters, and Sora is just a kid, so he probably ould not have the task of saving the worlds.

 

But if keyblade wielders are known for keeping balance WHY OH WHY would triton assume that sora was there to do anything but keep balance. also on several occasions king triton makes it very clear that he is aware that the heartless are a threat and since he knows sora is a wielder of the keyblade why wouldnt he have expected sora, who was fighting the darkness, to fulfill his role as a key wielder of keeping balance. 

That's not a plothole. That's an unaddressed issue. 

I'm fairly certain that arguing semantics is a logical fallacy

 

my question is why and how does he know about the keyblade and the keyholes.

Considering the number of keyblade weilders there once was and how the worlds all used to be connected as one, it can be assumed that some of the people around during that time passed the information down their heritage, the way Kairi's Granmother said it to her as a child.  As not only a citizen of Atlantica, but the King (and technically a God) of the city it would be justified for him to know about something that set the history of his world

.  

and since he knew sora was a keyblade wielder why didn't he just help immediately instead of waiting until his trident was stolen and his kingdom was in even more parel.

Again as a leader who knows that there should be no meddling in other worlds he most likely thought Sora shouldn't be meddling in his world and so shouldn't help him cause trouble.  He also didn't know Sora or his true intentions so it's expected to be suspicious.  You wouldn't help someone to break the rules that everyone who know about the war and keyblades were well aware of - "Don't meddle with the affairs of other worlds".  He really ends up resorting to Sora as a last choice when he ran out of options and needed to save his world.  After that he see's that Sora is really on his side.  Additionally, we saw him just blasting away the heartless with his trident at the palace, he was clearly capable of handling it , thinking these weak minded enemies were just swarming his ocean, not being lead and controlled by Ursula.  

 

hands down the best put together response. but:

wouldn't it have been fairly obvious that sora was on his side after he saved the life of tritons daughter. and as a leader wouldn't the heartless have been an immediate threat since they were in large enough numbers and close enough to his palace to attack his own daughter.

He was afraid that Sora might put Ariel in danger and probably didn't want any keyblade welders to enter his world because it'll risk the world in danger of the heartless. See what brings the heartless is the keyblade. They're after the keyblade. As to how he knows, its probably because he's a king/god, they have a vast knowledge, or he had an artifact indicating the keyblades existence. You know how Ariel have a cave full of artifacts from the human world that dropped under the sea? Maybe something fell in the ocean that King Triton found and was stolen by Ursula. Ansem report pehaps?

 

Yes it's more likely. If I recall right, you do get a report after defeating her.

that would mean that ursala had it not triton. and since the heartless were there before sora got there that argument wouldnt really hold.

But if keyblade wielders are known for keeping balance WHY OH WHY would triton assume that sora was there to do anything but keep balance. also on several occasions king triton makes it very clear that he is aware that the heartless are a threat and since he knows sora is a wielder of the keyblade why wouldnt he have expected sora, who was fighting the darkness, to fulfill his role as a key wielder of keeping balance. 

 

Fool. It is a keyblade master's duty, not some little kid.

Fool. It is a keyblade master's duty, not some little kid.

do you start all your posts with fool. because i'm gonna be honest i feel like I'm talking to excalibur.

and if sora has a keyblade and since no one else has been seen using one in like a decade it would be fair to assume that he's the closest they're getting to one.

do you start all your posts with fool. because i'm gonna be honest i feel like I'm talking to excalibur.

and if sora has a keyblade and since no one else has been seen using one in like a decade it would be fair to assume that he's the closest they're getting to one.

Fool. Yes, I start all of them with fool. Keyblade wielders aren't suppose to make themselves known. Hence the lack of people with knowledge of them. And, keyblade wielders can't really breath under water, unless they know the magic. Luckily for Sora, Donald knew the magic. I think everything points to King Triton being in the dark with everything that has been happening. He's immortal. Ten years must be nothing.

Fool. Yes, I start all of them with fool. Keyblade wielders aren't suppose to make themselves known. Hence the lack of people with knowledge of them. And, keyblade wielders can't really breath under water, unless they know the magic. Luckily for Sora, Donald knew the magic. I think everything points to King Triton being in the dark with everything that has been happening. He's immortal. Ten years must be nothing.

I can accept that he's simply oblivious i guess

In my opinion, Triton's knowledge on Keyblade wielders only stretches back to the Keyblade War. In that war, wielders of both Light and Darkness dueled and basically screwed stuff up, creating the universe as we know it today with several different 'worlds'. Since he's most likely immortal, as MasterXemnas pointed out, (or, at the very least, has been alive for a very long time) he could have easily been witness to the affair. Thus, his perception on Keyblade wielders is not a positive one since he knows they were the reason the universe was lost in darkness in the first place.

 

And, yeah, Keyblade wielders by this point were supposed to keep themselves a secret to the point that now, nobody knows what the hell a Keyblade is. Only the people who have been around long enough, and those are pretty far and few between. Even old Master Xehanort had to look it up on Wikipedia.

 

This may have been explained by someone else, idk. Just reiterating.

 

MY question is why the hell Triton left his triton completely defenseless after returning to the kingdom yelling about danger and Heartless? Chrissakes, guy. Also, why did no one else notice Ursula - the only person we know who is completely banished - was swimming around the kingdom with Ariel the whole time? Oh, right, nobody except the movie's characters exist in the Disney worlds. Never mind!  

In my opinion, Triton's knowledge on Keyblade wielders only stretches back to the Keyblade War. In that war, wielders of both Light and Darkness dueled and basically screwed stuff up, creating the universe as we know it today with several different 'worlds'. Since he's most likely immortal, as MasterXemnas pointed out, (or, at the very least, has been alive for a very long time) he could have easily been witness to the affair. Thus, his perception on Keyblade wielders is not a positive one since he knows they were the reason the universe was lost in darkness in the first place.

 

And, yeah, Keyblade wielders by this point were supposed to keep themselves a secret to the point that now, nobody knows what the hell a Keyblade is. Only the people who have been around long enough, and those are pretty far and few between. Even old Master Xehanort had to look it up on Wikipedia.

 

This may have been explained by someone else, idk. Just reiterating.

 

MY question is why the hell Triton left his triton completely defenseless after returning to the kingdom yelling about danger and Heartless? Chrissakes, guy. Also, why did no one else notice Ursula - the only person we know who is completely banished - was swimming around the kingdom with Ariel the whole time? Oh, right, nobody except the movie's characters exist in the Disney worlds. Never mind!  

RIGHT!?!?!?

I remember watching the scene and being like "TRITON YOU'RE TOO OLD TO BE MAKIN ROOKIE MISTAKES! COME ON MAN."

RIGHT!?!?!?

I remember watching the scene and being like "TRITON YOU'RE TOO OLD TO BE MAKIN ROOKIE MISTAKES! COME ON MAN."

Classic Disney right there, Triton: "Oh i'm the King of the sea and the plot demands me to leave my triton alone... Okay :D" *swims away* *palm to forehead*

 

My overall guess of how King Triton knew about being from another world is because Goofy spilled the beans about them being there to find the keyhole, remember King Triton saying "THE WHAT?" "No there is no such thing, Ariel not another word!" and instead of Sora staying to explain himself and the situation he just swam away with her to her grotto. Then he confronted him about being from another world because he is older and actually can line the pieces up: visitors that is don't look familiar to me ruler of the Sea, mentions the keyhole and goes about trying to reveal it with my daughter behind my back while defeating heartless, yup keyblade wielder. Plus it isn't far-fetched to think that since he knew about the key hole to his world that someone *cough cough a keyblade wielder* mentioned him about it. In later games it is mentioned how Mickey traveled to other worlds and had his own 'adventures', KH2 in Yen Sid's tower there was a book on a shelf that said it contains stories of the King's adventures and we know how he might of got there, that star thing for traveling from BBS and what Donald and Goofy used in DDD to 'save' everyone in the World That Never Was.

Kairi's Grandmother's story was based on the Keyblade Wars, it's possible that there are many other version of the story that survived, but only select individuals (like the rulers of the worlds) are aware of them. Triton may know a more complete version of the story, one involving the Keyblade. Because he only had partial knowledge, he may have seen Sora as a threat to his kingdoms peace. He didn't want to take the risk of letting Sora near the Keyhole.

As old he is , he might know about the Keyblade Wars .I mean even Kairi's grandmother knew . He may have heard what happened and that's why he told Sora all about the keyblades and the keyholes and how dangerous they are . He did not want to put his world in danger .