ladydualwieldin

If it's any consolation, I didn't make the post to "calm people down" or reassure anybody (although even if I did, I don't see why this should bug anyone). I made it because I thought it was an interesting twist that may very well happen and I was curious if anyone had any points to add, or even any legitimate rebuttals. Even if it's NOT canon in the end, I still enjoy discussing these possibilities because it's fun, and I'm now really fond of this possibility. Also, let's break this retcon business down, as defined by Google: retcon: a piece of new information that imposes a different interpretation on previously described events, typically used to facilitate a dramatic plot shift or account for an inconsistency. Just because nothing has pointed to the characters having relations to the Foretellers doesn't mean it's a retcon. A retcon would be if something previously said that they are NOT related to the Foretellers in any way, or if some piece of information existed against which this theory could be contrasted to say "oh, look! this is a contradiction!" The theory isn't a contradiction, it's a plot development. The word "retcon" is used much too loosely these days and rarely in the right context. The Ansem thing can't be a retcon, either, IMO, because there's nothing in earlier canon to contradict it; it was a development.

We don't know the entire X story, so it's a bit of a stretch to say anything's "grasping" at this point. We don't know all the details or how it'll turn out, so it's equally unfair to assume Square does or doesn't care, especially when this whole plot is very much Nomura's baby and he's spent 12 games and 15 years leading up to this conclusion. Every plot element he introduces has had a point, or presumably will in KH3, and I doubt the undeniable similarities between the Foretellers and modern characters are a coincidence. There ARE no coincidences in this series, although of course that doesn't automatically point to reincarnation, as I said above. And I'm honestly curious, how is this theory retconning anything? I see a lot of complaints about Nomura's past "retcons," but I don't know of any (except the time he said that Nobodies don't age and then took that back later, but to be fair he said that in an interview, so it was technically never canonly stated).

Thanks! Haha, I've built up this idea so much now that I'm really fond of it, so if they do look just like them, I may be a little disappointed. (Although I've been a fan of this theory since I first heard of it, so more facetwins won't be a deal-breaker for me.) And agreed! After Roxas and Ven, especially, (and Kairi/Xion/Namine) I would think it's obvious that Nomura doesn't just "duplicate" characters out of laziness or easy fanservice (whether they're literal physical copies or just something close). It's always plot relevant, so I'm not sure where all the misunderstanding and negativity about this theory come from.

At the risk of taking the joke too seriously: how so?

They've been saying for a while now that the NX is being kept so secret because they want to avoid having it copied, so I guess in hindsight its lack at E3 wasn't too surprising. And while copying the technology is inevitable, I do think there's a bit of cleverness in the way they're doing this; Sony and Microsoft are still at the tip of the iceberg with their VR tech, so letting them get neck-deep and more invested in that before the NX drops actually isn't a bad plan. It limits their resources and gives them less time and money to invest in copying Nintendo's tech.

So you may have seen me post about this on tumblr, or touch on it briefly in the recent news post, so forgive my laziness for just copy/pasting some of it here. But since Leopardos' and (possibly) Anguis' VAs were confirmed, I've seen an increase in hostility from anti-rebirth theory fans (and disappointment from supporters) claiming that this kills the theory. On the contrary, I think this bit of news actually supports it just as well. This is gonna get a bit lengthy, SO let's begin: There are two versions of the theory that I know of: A) that the modern day characters are literally the foretellers reincarnated, and B) they’re the foretellers’ blood descendants and have little to do with the foretellers themselves. For the sake of this discussion, and because I’ve always thought it more likely, I’m going to concentrate on the former option. First off, there’s one very important factor to consider: reincarnation does not equal copy/paste. In some cases, yes, but there are instances in other media where a reincarnated soul and their ancestor are not identical. I think the biggest example is the Legend of Zelda series; even without the graphical differences between games, we know that not all Links and Zeldas look totally alike (different hair colors being the most obvious factor), and they don’t all have the same VAs. On a simpler scale, think of Kagome and Kikyou from Inuyasha. Different voices, different faces, just very similar to one another. (Someone else also brought up Avatar the Last Airbender as an example, but since I'm unfamiliar with it, I'll have to take her word for it. ) THAT SAID If the reincarnation bit regarding the foretellers is true, I’m willing to bet that their faces aren’t totally identical to the modern characters’. Rather, they might have their own unique, individual appearances that simply have very striking similarities to the modern characters, which would make their ties obvious without taking the easiest route (I personally like this idea better, since it gives a bigger sense of individuality and avoids a third Ven/Roxas situation but hey, that’s just me). ADDITIONALLY With regards to their VAs, there were a number of people (myself included) who thought Anguis and Leo might be Willa and Jesse putting on different voices. Heck, I still think Vulpes sounds pretty close to Hayden. Also, we know that KH has this trend of using either obscure, rising live actors (Jason Dohring, etc) or big-name live actors (Mark Hamill) as opposed to the super popular, run-of-the-mill VAs that you find in a lot of anime and games (Troy Baker, Yuri Lowenthal, etc). If you look up Anguis’ and Leo’s VAs, Karissa and Kevin, you’ll see that they fall in the obscure category. What’s this mean? It means that KH intentionally went out of its way to scour out some no-name actors (no offense to them) who bear a very close resemblance to the actors they already have. Again, what’s this mean? This goes back to the idea that the foretellers are unique individuals, with their own faces and voices, and that the modern characters – again, IF the theory is true – are not copy-pasted versions, but just very physically similar. This would also suggest that, rather than, say, Anguis simply being “recycled” as an amnesiac in Aqua (as many anti-rebirth theory fans seem to feel), they’re actually both unique characters with their own hearts, minds, memories, etc. Since reincarnation is the basis here, they may share a soul, but this doesn’t make them the same person. It might influence them to be similar, but again, going back to the Legend of Zelda example, this does not make them the same exact person. They’re still influenced by their circumstances, friends, enemies, successes, failures, all that, and they have their own personalities. Each is her own person. In that regard, it’s almost more along the lines of the “descendant” option if you want to look at it that way. So yes, that's my two cents. To sum it up, I think the introduction of new-but-similar-sounding-actors is actually a step towards the rebirth theory being true, if only because it adds a layer of complication that Nomura is pretty famous for by now, and cleverly sidesteps both the issue of their VAs being instantly recognized and their identities spoiled and is more original than having the foretellers and modern characters as carbon copies of one another, and we all know KH is very much about originality. Or, at the very most, we may never receive direct confirmation that reincarnation was a factor, but simply be left to draw that conclusion ourselves based on the similarities between the characters (because making fans speculate is another thing Nomura loves to do, as he's admitted a few times). #things to think about until December

We don't know Aced's VA yet, do we? :|?

not necessarily? the foretellers could be older versions of the "present day" characters, hence the need for the voice changes, or the English version could have wanted to avoid such blatant similarities. or the English VAs could have lacked the exact tone that the Foretellers need to have. I can't speak too much for the Japanese VAs, but they did seem to support the theory in sounding nearly identical to the original actors. I do think it's notable that while these are new voice actors, they do bear some very close similarities to the present day characters, and since Kevin and Karissa are more no-name/rising actors (as opposed to any of the very popular anime/game VAs who are commonly used in everything else these days), it's obvious KH went out of its way to get those voices in particular. or, actually, let me put it this way: reincarnation doesn't mean copy/paste. If you look at other games and anime, reincarnated characters don't always resemble their original entirely (Legend of Zelda, for instance). there's a chance that the Foretellers could have their own voices and faces and just have striking similarities to the other characters that make the tie clear without it being a direct copy. that's just my two cents though.

They do! Which is pretty neat, I think, because it breaks the common tradition of recycling a lot of the same voices that many games and anime tend to do. That said, I personally find Travis Willingham and Troy Baker unlikely for this reason, since they're already big anime/game names (and Troy in particular is in a ton of stuff lately), but eh, who knows!

Huh. Weird, considering all the Japanese Foreteller voices seem to be repeat VAs. Wonder why they would break from tradition and not have them match up in English? Or maybe the Japanese VAs just sound close to the originals, much like the English ones sound pretty close.

Agreed! Coded, BBS, and DDD all spell out who Sora's going to save, and Xion's always included. Ansem the Wise also suggested in DDD that Sora will be able to save those who no longer exist, so that also covers Xion and Roxas. Also agreed! I've been saying this for the longest time. I imagine she, Roxas, and Lea will all be kind of "back-ups" to the Guardians of Light, which would be fitting considering the three of them are more "twilight"-oriented and aren't supposed to actually exist in the first place, meaning they're kind of a secret weapon on the good guys' part.

A trailer seems obvious, and since we were specifically told to expect "announcements," I'm hoping a release window will be dropped, maybe some renders for characters we haven't seen yet?

Caius! He's a very up-close-and-personal kind of boss that would make him good for KH. He could be the first boss to instantly auto-resurrect after you beat him just to infuriate take everyone by surprise.

Yep, it ended up being pulled from the American channel in record time because it was so badly received. I've never heard a good thing about it, actually.

There's another thing a lot of people seem to overlook (although it is a tad confusing) -- Master Xehanort says in DDD that because his plan with Sora failed, all the Darknesses are returning whence they came, but before that he explains that once a person has been affected by time travel, that leaves a mark on their heart even though their minds lose the memory of it. That mark is what will lead all his Darknesses to "their destiny" with him in the future (KH3) of their own accord, he says, since his last plan failed. This implies that all of the Darknesses in KH3 are people currently alive in the present, not individuals pulled from the past. Master Xehanort was reborn and Young Xehanort holds the time travel powers, so I think they'll be the only Xehanort incarnations serving as Darknesses in KH3 (plus Xemnas and Ansem, but they're essentially their own individual people). The time travel shenanigans, with the exception of Young Xehanort, should be over with DDD; otherwise, Xehanort could have saved time and just pulled 12 versions of his younger self from the past. That would have been much faster, more efficient, and deadly.

thank you! my nails are all natural, but I wouldn't mind painting up some faux ones if some other ladies are interested. I'll have to ask around! thank yooou

Should I be glad he's not my Union leader, or

thank you! sexiest box art rly

I'm super psyched for KH2.8, not least of all because MORE AQUA, so I decided to try my hand (pun not intended) at some watermom-themed nails. I just really love posing with my BBS box tbh,

I'm gonna break this up into pieces if you don't mind-- otherwise we would have seen him (as a free person) in DDD Not necessarily. Assuming Terra is free and whole at present, any number of things could have gone wrong so that we didn't see him. He could have run off to recuperate; he could be amnesiac and wandered off; he could have fled from Xehanort or another enemy; someone else could have grabbed him. (Alternatively, as I currently suspect, Terra isn't whole and has yet to be reborn, which would also explain why we haven't seen him.) it wouldn't have been difficult for Xehanort to capture him again As I said in my previous post, BBS makes it clear that keeping a hold on Terra is difficult, and Xehanort said that he's open to backup plans if he did lose Terra. If they were separated upon being reborn (which only makes sense), that does count as "losing him," and as I said before I don't think Xehanort would bother when he has so many other vessels already and Terra nearly beat him out once before. Considering Terra is now aware of Xehanort's intentions and is most likely immune to darkness, taking possession of him again would be difficult. they were both reborn in the same place We don't know that for sure. It's likely, considering that was where Apprentice Xehanort turned his Keyblade on himself, but it has yet to be confirmed. And even if they did wake up together, I go back to my argument that Terra could have woken up first and left, or Xehanort could have simply left him there because he didn't want him.

We were slammed with a lot of info in KH3D, so I can't blame people for overlooking the more subtle hints, I suppose. And a lot of it takes Terra's character development in BBS into account, which gets overlooked a lot, either because he's not one of the more popular characters, or because his development was all managed in one game as opposed to stretched out more obviously over several (like Riku). Mostly, though, I think Terranort just seems like the obvious answer to a lot of people because there's nothing blatant saying otherwise yet. (And YES, Eraqus' heart, too! Another good point.)

Actually, Xehanort never told us he had Terra. He said he now had "two of the Lights," referring to Sora and a second -- whom I believe was Ventus, since owning Sora meant he had Ventus' heart. That aside, though-- Terranort should no longer exist. Terranort was created by Master Xehanort's full heart possessing Terra's body; Xehanort's heart is now back in his own body, as we see when he's reborn, and he creates his Seekers of Darkness by putting pieces of his heart in them. Considering how much trouble he had controlling Terra with his WHOLE heart, I really doubt he could do so with only 1/13th of his heart now. Consider also their words in Blank Points, when Xehanort basically says "if I ever did lose you, it's okay, I have a bunch of back-up plans." It can be assumed that he did lose Terra upon being reborn, and getting him back will be too much trouble (consider Terra's words, as well, which all but confirm that he too has become immune to darkness like Riku). All that said, I do believe they are and will remain separate, and Xehanort won't bother with Terra at this point.

I feel you! I've been hoarding my jewels forever as I wait for the Ven/Terra/Aqua medals. As has been said, it's hard to predict the exact schedule, but since they started releasing the Org 13 medals, I wouldn't think Roxas and the others are far behind (he and Xion are also villain medals, funny enough, so they're part of the Org 13 reverse set). It seems like they tend to do a new medal release every other week, or every three weeks (with special deals in between), so I'd expect a new set next Friday since we didn't get one last week. And while it is a lottery, some of the 3000 jewel deals do guarantee that you'll get at least one of the new medals released that week, so it might pay to do the draw as soon as it comes out. (And I don't keep up with the JP version, but I want to say Roxas might be a limited time medal? Someone correct me if I'm wrong, though.)

Agreeing with what's been said, the demo video was terrible quality + the game isn't finished yet, so he might (should) end up looking better by December. If his model DOES look like this in 2.8, I'm going to assume they'll make a better/more polished one for him in KH3, since it would be odd for Aqua, Sora, Riku, and Kairi (and presumably the rest) to look as good as they do only for Terra to look so... flat. If they did just transfer it over to KH3, I'd be very surprised; it's quite possible they put less effort into this 2.8 model since it has much less screentime and (I assume) it doesn't have much animation (no fighting, etc.), although I wouldn't expect the KH team to be that lazy. On that same vein of thought, maybe they didn't have time to polish him up before releasing the demo. But again, I expect Terra to be prettied up by the final product at the end of this year.

Two foul-mouthed dudes sitting around drinking and talking about games they know nothing about. How can this possibly go wrong?? (I made it as far as Dawn of Cerberus and quit tbh.)