If Kairi is going to be in KH3 as a playable character she better get her B.A.M.F on like in this video 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BScCA2iq5Tw

 

 

 

how does having vens heart not make him ven though? A body does not a persona make, its the heart. Ven's heart is there without his memories making Roxas Ven EVEN though its Sora's body 

 

If you were in a different body you would still be you, like how Xehanort is in a bunch of different bodies. The difference is is that Ven's persona was a clean slate from being an amnesiac and thus developed a new one on 358/2 days. 

 

Because he had NO MEMORIES FROM VEN . The heart was asleep or dormant meaning he got nothing from that heart but his appearance .You can look like someone but not be them . If he had Ven's memories you might have more of a case but no . Also Kairi's heart rested in Sora but Sora was not Kairi-. There is a lot of people resting in Sora but he is not them - he is Sora. He gave Ven's heart a place to stay and heal and Roxas being his physical body carried on that favor . In other words- he's got a part of Ven . Yes . But is he himself Ven ? No Roxas is still Sora with part of Ven sleeping inside. Then he developed his own self over time and grew his own heart on top of that based off his own MEMORIES and experiences

Edited December 27, 201311 yr by Flaming Lea

Yeah, nomaking her suddenly over powered and "badass" out of the blue doesn't set well with me. If she' must (or we are forced to play as her) then have her like kh1 sora.

Thanks you. I said this like in the 1st page and I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks the same thing on this topic.

how does having vens heart not make him ven though? A body does not a persona make, its the heart. Ven's heart is there without his memories making Roxas Ven EVEN though its Sora's body 

 

If you were in a different body you would still be you, like how Xehanort is in a bunch of different bodies. The difference is is that Ven's persona was a clean slate from being an amnesiac and thus developed a new one on 358/2 days. 

Actually it's the heart AND soul I think. You know Terra's Lingering Spirit in KH2FM? That's also him. Therefore you need both. Ventus' soul is most likely still with Ventus. IDK.

Actually it's the heart AND soul I think. You know Terra's Lingering Spirit in KH2FM? That's also him. Therefore you need both. Ventus' soul is most likely still with Ventus. IDK.

 

 

The soul stays within the body or you die according to Nomura so yes Ven's soul is with him in CO while Sora's is within his body. Terra's sentiment is his thoughts trapped in his armor

Edited December 27, 201311 yr by Flaming Lea

Because he had NO MEMORIES FROM VEN . The heart was asleep or dormant meaning he got nothing from that heart but his appearance .You can look like someone but not be them . If he had Ven's memories you might have more of a case but no . Also Kairi's heart rested in Sora but Sora was not Kairi-. There is a lot of people resting in Sora but he is not them - he is Sora. He gave Ven's heart a place to stay and heal and Roxas being his physical body carried on that favor . In other words- he's got a part of Ven . Yes . But is he himself Ven ? No he is still Sora with Ven inside.

If you had lost all your memories would that mean you were not you anymore? Its the heart that is the important component here and Ven's heart was controlling Sora's nobody thus giving him his appearance. His PERSONA, who he was, his memories were not there but his heart was. Roxas and Ventus are different personas stemming from the same heart, same for Vanitas (though that's an even more complicated mess) 

 

As for your point about other hearts being inside Sora, that's a different issue all together (this shiz needs its own thread though) 

But cut her hair, though. 

haha that would be awesome but I highly doubt she will be this powerful in the first game we get to control her.

 

Does anyone want KH3 to be like KH BBS with having 3 separate stories that tie into each other? I would love for Kairi to have her own story.

If you had lost all your memories would that mean you were not you anymore? Its the heart that is the important component here and Ven's heart was controlling Sora's nobody thus giving him his appearance. His PERSONA, who he was, his memories were not there but his heart was. Roxas and Ventus are different personas stemming from the same heart, same for Vanitas (though that's an even more complicated mess) 

 

As for your point about other hearts being inside Sora, that's a different issue all together (this shiz needs its own thread though) 

 You are missing your own point . Yes a heart makes a person . Why ? Because the experiences and the memories that it's built from . Ven's heart had none of these which means Roxas did not have his persona, his thoughts, his experiences that shaped Ven into who he was . Roxas had nothing and had to start from scratch except for when he slowly started getting back some of Sora's memories over time. Xehanort himself is a whole different story since you have two different people with both of their memories /experiences in their hearts mixed together to form AX who later formed Xemnas. Both Battling for control but inside the shared body

 

Roxas had one heart inside that was dormant and not mixed with Sora's . He himself was also still tied to Sora's heart since he was his nobody. Ven's heart was separate and provided no memories or experiences . Non comparable with the series definition of what makes a person their own self .

Only the bulk of that Dead Fantasy installment is actually Namine.  Though you do see here fight from this point in the first episodes:

http://youtu.be/iO8RxVCMrUo?t=11m15s

 

While it looks awesome, a lot of the moves are copied from other games, like Tekken.  I don't see SE ripping the moves off other companies for their official games.

 

It would be fun but...this is Naminé. And Kairi wouldn't be THAT strong in the first game she fights...It's a bit too much. That's like some master level Keyblade-Wielding.

 

Kairi's strength and all could appear enhanced due to the crash training she'll get like Lea did and her position as a Princess of Heart to be fair.  

 You are missing your own point . Yes a heart makes a person . Why ? Because the experiences and the memories that it's built from . Ven's heart had none of these which means Roxas did not have his persona, his thoughts, his experiences that shaped Ven into who he was . Roxas had nothing and had to start from scratch except for when he slowly started getting back some of Sora's memories over time. Xehanort himself is a whole different story since you have two different people with both of their memories /experiences in their hearts mixed together to form AX who later formed Xemnas. Both Battling for control but inside the shared body

 

Roxas had one heart inside that was dormant and not mixed with Sora's . He himself was also still tied to Sora's heart since he was his nobody. Ven's heart was separate and provided no memories or experiences . Non comparable with the series definition of what makes a person their own self .

*face desk* omfg... you are giving me a headache. 

I'm saying the same thing! They are two different personalities, to different "personas" with two different sets of memories but they have the same heart. The heart that was Ven's first and then Roxas. One heart, two people. But I'm saying that because that's Ven's heart, that means that Roxas CAME from ven even though he has an entirely different set of memories and personality. I'm not saying they are the same person in terms of Memories and Personality, but they both have the same exact heart.

*face desk* omfg... you are giving me a headache. 

I'm saying the same thing! They are two different personalities, to different "personas" with two different sets of memories but they have the same heart. The heart that was Ven's first and then Roxas. One heart, two people. But I'm saying that because that's Ven's heart, that means that Roxas CAME from ven even though he has an entirely different set of memories and personality. I'm not saying they are the same person in terms of Memories and Personality, but they both have the same exact heart.

  Yeah and  DDD told us that not only did Roxas have Ven's heart - he grew his own separate heart over time bc he developed his own sense of self through his ties to other people, memories , and experiences over that time frame . So he had Ven's heart and then developed his OWN .. Anyways you were the one who said he was Ventus- i'm saying he's not because of the above reasoning but that he is made up of part Ven. If this is still continuing even though you are claiming to think the same thing why disagree with what i said in the first place when i clarified this above ?. Then tell ME i'm giving you a headache ? lolololol

Only the bulk of that Dead Fantasy installment is actually Namine.  Though you do see here fight from this point in the first episodes:

http://youtu.be/iO8RxVCMrUo?t=11m15s

 

While it looks awesome, a lot of the moves are copied from other games, like Tekken.  I don't see SE ripping the moves off other companies for their official games.

 

 

Kairi's strength and all could appear enhanced due to the crash training she'll get like Lea did and her position as a Princess of Heart to be fair.  

Well clearly we would not want them copying movesets from other games, I'm referring to how badass she could become, the vid from dead fantasy was just an example. 

And Yes like EVERYONE is pointing out its Namine, even though they are technically the same person I can't see why Namine couldn't be Kairis Drive form or something like that. She gets the Namine gauge up and then turns into her for a few minutes, kicks some ass and goes back to Kairi.

And given she is a princess of heart and a keyblade weilder I don't think its out of the realm of possibility that she could get that tough. 

The soul stays within the body or you die according to Nomura so yes Ven's soul is with him in CO while Sora's is within his body. Terra's sentiment is his thoughts trapped in his armor

Those are just his thoughts? Dang. His thoughts must be very powerful to cause those epic attacks or something.

Those are just his thoughts? Dang. His thoughts must be very powerful to cause those epic attacks or something.

 

Hahahah I think so considering the circumstances

  Yeah and  DDD told us that not only did Roxas have Ven's heart - he grew his own separate heart over time bc he developed his own sense of self through his ties to other people, memories , and experiences over that time frame . So he had Ven's heart and then developed his OWN .. Anyways you were the one who said he was Ventus- i'm saying he's not because of the above reasoning but that he is made up of part Ven. If this is still continuing even though you are claiming to think the same thing why disagree with what i said in the first place when i clarified this above ?. Then tell ME i'm giving you a headache ? lolololol

What is giving me a headache is that we are almost on the same page, but our terminology is different. Its an arguement in semantics, like looking at two different translations of the same text.

Now this idea that Roxas developed his own seperate heart is new too me, do you have a vid or something showing that?  

Thanks you. I said this like in the 1st page and I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks the same thing on this topic.

 

 

Yeah, nomaking her suddenly over powered and "badass" out of the blue doesn't set well with me. If she' must (or we are forced to play as her) then have her like kh1 sora.

Agreed

What is giving me a headache is that we are almost on the same page, but our terminology is different. Its an arguement in semantics, like looking at two different translations of the same text.

Now this idea that Roxas developed his own seperate heart is new too me, do you have a vid or something showing that?  

 

Go watch the DDD cutscenes and read the DDD interviews . It's the reason Roxas was told by Sora he was his own person and deserved to have his own life and basically how they are gonna be able to bring back the " fallen comrades" discussed by Ansem the Wise and how his data he hid in Sora will help with this. This was an integral point in this game about how everything can grow hearts and how Sora can use this to help these aforementioned people.

Edited December 27, 201311 yr by Flaming Lea

Go watch the DDD cutscenes and read the DDD interviews . It's the reason Roxas was told by Sora he was his own person and deserved to have his own life and basically how they are gonna be able to bring back the " fallen comrades" discussed by Ansem the Wise and how his data he hid in Sora will help with this 

O.O well I did watch them but I did not pick up on that... So even though he started off with Ven's heart he cut the cord and now is his own person? 

 

Okay, with that knowledge they are as of now two entirely different people, though this wasn't the case at first. 

 

God I love how complicated this crap is . 

O.O well I did watch them but I did not pick up on that... So even though he started off with Ven's heart he cut the cord and now is his own person? 

 

Okay, with that knowledge they are as of now two entirely different people, though this wasn't the case at first. 

 

God I love how complicated this crap is . 

 

Well see, despite carrying Ven's dormant heart his body was missing his own which allowed it to grow a new one over time . So yes yes this is why I said he's his very own person . The complications make the plot interesting and fun to me .. except TimeTravel , which though I understand it , feel it's cliche and cheesy. I still love the plot though !

She sure is badass in Dead Fantasy, but it would not make sense of she is all like this in KH3.

Well see, despite carrying Ven's dormant heart his body was missing his own which allowed it to grow a new one over time . So yes yes this is why I said he's his very own person . The complications make the plot interesting and fun to me .. except TimeTravel , which though I understand it , feel it's cliche and cheesy. I still love the plot though !

Completely agree with you . 

As for the time travel thing, you kind of knew that was coming. That's how all good complicated plots get hella convoluted ( I'm looking at you LOST )

Completely agree with you . 

As for the time travel thing, you kind of knew that was coming. That's how all good complicated plots get hella convoluted ( I'm looking at you LOST >.>)

 

I was soo hoping it wouldn't go there  ( denial ) LOL

Was expecting clip of Bayonetta. But this is good too

Well clearly we would not want them copying movesets from other games, I'm referring to how badass she could become, the vid from dead fantasy was just an example. 

And Yes like EVERYONE is pointing out its Namine, even though they are technically the same person I can't see why Namine couldn't be Kairis Drive form or something like that. She gets the Namine gauge up and then turns into her for a few minutes, kicks some ass and goes back to Kairi.

And given she is a princess of heart and a keyblade weilder I don't think its out of the realm of possibility that she could get that tough. 

 

I've already mentioned before after seeing this video that it would be neat to see Kairi fighting and her changing into Namine/when she's near no health Namine actually jumping out from her (since they melded together) and deflecting what should be a final blow then fighting for her while she charges up, but the story of the game is pushing towards the Nobodies having their independence and being their own person so I can't see Namine being reduced to a form.  Also a lot of people brought it up that Namine seems more of the strategist when I brought it up rather than a fighter.  

 

Additionally I basically said your last point in my previous post.  JS.  

That video was done my Monty Oum. hes pretty cool at fight scenes and choreography