Is definitely when they say "well a previous KH game said this" as if plot points from previous KH games are never changed, expanded on, or turn out to be outright wrong

it's literally the focal point of the KH plot

 

Is definitely when they say "well a previous KH game said this" as if plot points from previous KH games are never changed, expanded on, or turn out to be outright wrongit's literally the focal point of the KH plot

The only thing we can trust is Nomura's interviews, which is why I stopped watching cutscenes and just stick to gameplay and then read a plot summary after.

We live in a rational world, and in a rational world, past experiences are useful in trying to determine what the future might hold, so nerds people tend to do the same thing with fiction they like.

 

KH is like the polar opposite of rational, so obviously no one should try to think that way when talking about it, but it's really hard to break the habit that every single human engages in all the time.

I expected sarcasm in this post...

I wasn't disappointed

We live in a rational world, and in a rational world, past experiences are useful in trying to determine what the future might hold, so nerds people tend to do the same thing with fiction they like.

 

KH is like the polar opposite of rational, so obviously no one should try to think that way when talking about it, but it's really hard to break the habit that every single human engages in all the time.

If people's actions were based on previous experiences they'd know how KH operates. Anybody should be able to realize that unless something is explicitly stated in KH it's pretty probable there's something else to it

My favorite thing about Kingdom Hearts fans is the fan made manga which they draw.

If people's actions were based on previous experiences they'd know how KH operates. Anybody should be able to realize that unless something is explicitly stated in KH it's pretty probable there's something else to it

 

Agreed- and even when it's explicitly stated, it's more often than not retconned anyway. It's just a naturally human thing to try and figure out what direction things are going based on the facts they already have, even if it's a completely futile exercise (and with KH, it is). It's stupid, but I can't really blame anyone for doing it.

Is definitely when they say "well a previous KH game said this" as if plot points from previous KH games are never changed, expanded on, or turn out to be outright wrong

it's literally the focal point of the KH plot

Have you ever....EVER...heard in your entire life the meaning of the word retcon?

 

You would've if you read all the previous AnsemXehanort reports in which they state some facts that AnsemXehanort said it could not be changed yet it got changed because plot convenience 

 

Also just flat out say it that your statement is directed towards me

Edited July 2, 201510 yr by Smash Mega Koopa

Have you ever....EVER...heard in your entire life the meaning of the word retcon?

 

You would've if you read all the previous AnsemXehanorts in which they state some facts that AnsemXehanort said it could not be changed yet it got changed because plot convenience 

 

Also just flat out say it that your statement is directed towards me

 

Yep! Nomura has stated he's been writing this as he goes so yes there are retcons and anyone who thinks otherwise is kidding themselves.

Yep! Nomura has stated he's been writing this as he goes so yes there are retcons and anyone who thinks otherwise is kidding themselves.

Still, he's done an awesome job of weaving all the parts of the story together.

Still, he's done an awesome job of weaving all the parts of the story together.

Meh. Sometimes. Regardless I still love the story though so he's doing something right

Meh. Sometimes. Regardless I still love the story though so he's doing something right

He sure is.

Have you ever....EVER...heard in your entire life the meaning of the word retcon?

 

You would've if you read all the previous AnsemXehanort reports in which they state some facts that AnsemXehanort said it could not be changed yet it got changed because plot convenience 

 

Also just flat out say it that your statement is directed towards me

I've never denied KH has retcons

I've literally said as much in this thread

t

it's the fact that people don't expect retcons that confuses me

I've never denied KH has retcons

I've literally said as much in this thread

t

it's the fact that people don't expect retcons that confuses me

When retcons are badly implemented and serves to add more confusing stuff than getting red of the stuff holding the story back then that screams bad writing and my friend Flaming Lea has pointed that out so many times already

 

 

Even the retcons of DCMarvel comics aren't as blatant and poorly done as this

 

you denied the retcon when you said "as if plot points from previous KH games are never changed, expanded on, or turn out to be outright wrong"

 

They were retconned badly ,changed to something worse and served to bug down the story rather than expanding it

Edited July 2, 201510 yr by Smash Mega Koopa

The KH fanbase is both one of the best and one of the worst fanbases out there.

The KH fanbase is both one of the best and one of the worst fanbases out there.

This fanbase is also great at pushing away newcomers from the series and taking any sort of little criticism towards an aspect in the series as if it's a personal insult towards a family memberfriend or something

Edited July 3, 201510 yr by Smash Mega Koopa

Hold on, what's a retcon?  I've never heard that term before.

Hold on, what's a retcon?  I've never heard that term before.

It's when you come up with a plot point or a plot device in a story specifically to nullify the effect of a previous event or a plot point as if they didn't happen

 

For example:The nobodies now can grow their own hearts is a retcon,cuz it was established before that they can't

 

Another example when in the Xehanort reports Master Xehanort said the only way to forge the X-Blade is by merging 1 pure light and 1 pure darkness,go read them he said it's "the only way" to forge the keyblade.....fast forward to Dream Drop Distance where this specific plot point got retconned into 7 lights and 13 darknesses despite Xehanort specifically stating in his reports that it's the only way,making the entire existence of Vanitas and the whole experiment with him and Ventus completely pointless

and taking any sort of little criticism towards an aspect in the series as if it's a personal insult

I've experienced this one too many times to count... I can definitely confirm this one's true.

I've experienced this one too many times to count... I can definitely confirm this one's true.

And this my friend,is exactly why this series is having a hard time progressing and evolving,cuz all the feedback that reaches Square Enix and Nomura about this series is 99% blind loyalty and barely any of them talk about something that needs to be addressed and even when they do they get assaulted by hundreds of angry mobs that get offended even by the slightest of criticism even if it's a little nitpick.May I remind you that many of them either play nothing but Kingdom Hearts or only play Square games only never exposing themselves to other RPGs with different types of story telling,world building and character development

 

I'm not joking when I say that a youtuber I watch(Matt from YoVideoGames who works with Maximillian Dood) recieved death threats just because he was in a video about E3 2010 playing the Birth by Sleep demo with one hand and won....that's it.He never said any impressions neither negative nor positive and suddenly he got assaulted by the KH fanbase for practically no reason

 

 

This series is losing more fans by the day and whenever a newcomer wants to get in they got the most unwelcoming reaction you can ever see for an RPG fanbase

 

And if Kingdom Hearts 3 doesn't address the issues people before me mentioned many times on many other places,then for me all hope for the series is lost

And this my friend,is exactly why this series is having a hard time progressing and evolving,cuz all the feedback that reaches Square Enix and Nomura about this series is 99% blind loyalty and barely any of them talk about something that needs to be addressed and even when they do they get assaulted by hundreds of angry mobs that get offended even by the slightest of criticism even if it's a little nitpick.May I remind you that many of them either play nothing but Kingdom Hearts or only play Square games only never exposing themselves to other RPGs with different types of story telling,world building and character development

 

I'm not joking when I say that a youtuber I watch(Matt from YoVideoGames who works with Maximillian Dood) recieved death threats just because he was in a video about E3 2010 playing the Birth by Sleep demo with one hand and won....that's it.He never said any impressions neither negative nor positive and suddenly he got assaulted by the KH fanbase for practically no reason

 

 

This series is losing more fans by the day and whenever a newcomer wants to get in they got the most unwelcoming reaction you can ever see for an RPG fanbase

 

And if Kingdom Hearts 3 doesn't address the issues people before me mentioned many times on many other places,then for me all hope for the series is lost

There was also the whole ProJared incident, when he lost thousands of subscribers because he said "I think Kingdom Hearts is stupid," but he was happy for the fans that there was a lot of footage for KHIII at E3 this year, and said that was pretty much the only thing that saved Square at E3 this year. I honestly just avoid saying my opinions on some things with the series (Even when it's a minor problem with a game that I actually really enjoy) just because some people will take it way too seriously.

There was also the whole ProJared incident, when he lost thousands of subscribers because he said "I think Kingdom Hearts is stupid," but he was happy for the fans that there was a lot of footage for KHIII at E3 this year, and said that was pretty much the only thing that saved Square at E3 this year. I honestly just avoid saying my opinions on some things with the series (Even when it's a minor problem with a game that I actually really enjoy) just because some people will take it way too seriously.

Yyyeah I witnessed Projared's loss of subs.......cuz god forbid the guy has a different opinion or happened to likedislike something that others don't

 

I'm pretty much on the same boat here cuz saying my opinion on the series  got me nothing but troubles.Which is one of the many many reasons why I expanded my RPG horizons beyond Square Enix RPGs(Well Squaresoft's stuff are still great though) and beyond KH

Yyyeah I witnessed Projared's loss of subs.......cuz god forbid the guy has a different opinion or happened to likedislike something that others don't

 

I'm pretty much on the same boat here cuz saying my opinion on the series  got me nothing but troubles.Which is one of the many many reasons why I expanded my RPG horizons beyond Square Enix RPGs(Well Squaresoft's stuff are still great though) and beyond KH

And let's all ignore that he was happy for KH fans, too.

 

Same here, although I don't really think I had any specific reason to look into other RPGs. It just sort of happened for me.

And let's all ignore that he was happy for KH fans, too.

 

Same here, although I don't really think I had any specific reason to look into other RPGs. It just sort of happened for me.

Well I recall you loving Xenoblade to death ^_^ so that's the starting point to expand on already.

 

A whole new world(no Aladdin pun intended) awaits you:Shin Megami Tensei,Persona,Suikoden,Fire Emblem,Golden Sun,the Tales of series,Skies of Arcadia,Lost Oddysey.......etc

 

Sure it might take you a while to get into some of them but they're fun.Granted you don't have to try them all just look them up and see what you're getting into.

 

And btw,I can't wait for a ProJared episode on Kingdom Hearts. if you ask me

Edited July 3, 201510 yr by Smash Mega Koopa

Well I recall you loving Xenoblade to death ^_^ so that's the starting point to expand on already.

 

A whole new world(no Aladdin pun intended) awaits you:Shin Megami Tensei,Persona,Suikoden,Fire Emblem,Golden Sun,the Tales of series,Skies of Arcadia,Lost Oddysey.......etc

 

Sure it might take you a while to get into some of them but they're fun.Granted you don't have to try them all just look them up and see what you're getting into.

 

And btw,I can't wait for a ProJared episode on Kingdom Hearts. if you ask me

Yep, Xenoblade's been a big one. I also just recently got into the Tales series with Xillia, and I have Xillia 2 downloaded and everything for when I finish the first (Both were on sale, so I figured I might as well pick them up). Suikoden's one that sounds really promising, too. Both that and the older Xeno games (Xenogears and the Xenosaga trilogy) are probably next on my list to try out.

It's funny when they think Nomura had planned everything since he was character designer for FFVII.

Edited July 3, 201510 yr by Aru Akise