Then..........what happens to the original heart that used to inhabit the body before it was casted away to become a heartless?

 

Since if I remember correctly,nobodies used to be the bodies left of said human who became a heartless(unless You're Sora or Xehanort in which case your nobody gets his own freaking body separately from you for some reason).........and according to Dream Drop Distance(f*** this game btw) nobodies can grow their own hearts

 

So then...........what happen to the dude who lost hisher body and became a heartless....all while their own nobody grow a heart of his own?Do they stay as a heartless forever or just die and see their bodies become basically the equivilant of a possessed corpse?

 

 

This confuses the shit outta me and it didn't occur to me how stupid it is until a let's player who's currently LPing Kingdom Hearts 2 talked about it.

They reunite with their original hearts when the said nobody and heartless are destroyed. If they started or did grow a new heart it's prolly merged with the old original one.

 

 What is the definition of a heart in Kingdom Hearts?

Nomura: It is the theme of the series. To explain it simply, a person has a body, a soul, and a heart. As an image, the soul is the life source, without it a person would be dead. Since the heart doesn’t have a form, memories play an important part in forming a heart. Also, the heart isn’t limited to people, but to all things. I tried to explain this concept to Disney, and they merely said that it must be an Eastern way of thinking. It may be interesting how overseas players think of it.

 

 

 

It's based off the same body and soul and memories of said nobody It's just an accumulation of new memories,experiences, and emotions from that time period in their life. When Lea revived he still remembered everything during his time as a nobody bc he's still the same person as Axel just now with his original heart back plus whatever new memories and experiences he had as Axel adding on to it...Of course special nobodies are a diff case though.

 

Sora was a walking heart until he was reunited with Roxas. He did not have an actual real body per se.

 

Ansem possessed someone ( Riku) to get a body.

 

They reunite with their original hearts when the said nobody and heartless are destroyed. If they started or did grow a new heart it's prolly merged with the old original one.

 

 What is the definition of a heart in Kingdom Hearts?

Nomura: It is the theme of the series. To explain it simply, a person has a body, a soul, and a heart. As an image, the soul is the life source, without it a person would be dead. Since the heart doesn’t have a form, memories play an important part in forming a heart. Also, the heart isn’t limited to people, but to all things. I tried to explain this concept to Disney, and they merely said that it must be an Eastern way of thinking. It may be interesting how overseas players think of it.

 

 

 

It's based off the same body and soul and memories of said nobody It's just an accumulation of new memories,experiences, and emotions from that time period in their life. When Lea revived he still remembered everything during his time as a nobody bc he's still the same person as Axel just now with his original heart back plus whatever new memories and experiences he had as Axel adding on to it...Of course special nobodies are a diff case though.

 

Sora was a walking heart until he was reunited with Roxas. He did not have an actual real body per se.

 

Ansem possessed someone ( Riku) to get a body.

 

I mean....what if the nobody didn't die and kept on living?

Also.........since Sora was a walking heart in Chain of Memories.......how did his body grow when he was put to sleep for a whole year by Namine?

I mean....what if the nobody didn't die and kept on living?

 

Then they would remain the same- a nobody that started growing a heart or did grow a heart. If their heartless is not slain then it's not slain and they cannot reunite. The nobody lives on without reuniting with it's original heart. ( although nobodies and their heartless are always connected to each other)

I mean....what if the nobody didn't die and kept on living?Also.........since Sora was a walking heart in Chain of Memories.......how did his body grow when he was put to sleep for a whole year by Namine?

"The heart shapes the vessel, not the other way around"It's the heart that ages. The reason Nobodoes appear to age is because1. They start aging again as soon at their start growing a heart. 2. Naminé existed at the same time as her human counterparthe so she was still connected to her heart in a way. Roxas never aged, likely becuse it was Ven's heart that shaped him and that heart was dormant nearly his entire life.3. Certain Nobodies (Xigbar, Saïx) had a piece of Xehanorts heart in them so, not only td they age, they start resembling the old man. First the eyes, then the ears, then the hair, then the skin.Since the body tries to replace the heart the first chance it gets, a heart likely starts forming as soon as the Nobody comes in contact with another person "Each expire to light, to the outside world, shapes this most malleable part of us" it probably starts happening in a matter of days.Someone without a heart who has been completely isolated like Ven, wouldn't have aged because he hasn't had any new experiences to become the foundation of a new heart.

Edited October 19, 201510 yr by Isamu_Kuno

I mean....what if the nobody didn't die and kept on living?

Also.........since Sora was a walking heart in Chain of Memories.......how did his body grow when he was put to sleep for a whole year by Namine?

 

I did not see this second part of your question when I posted ? You must have double posted and it automerged.

 

Anyways the heart still grows and ages so that makes sense. Sora being a walking heart from the end of KH1 through kh2 when he reunited with Roxas is fact. The heart shapes the vessel. 

I'm just glad That Nobodies can't have their own individual heartless and nobody. Otherwise it'd be way too hard to track down Xehanort that way.

 

Luckily the Nobodies don't actually "Form" their own working heart that could make them into actual people. It is merely their memories that are stored inside the nobody until they are defeated as well as the heartless to become a single person once again.

 

What I'm thinking about right now:

 

A Dusk's life: Before, During, and After becoming two different things.

 

Random guy's life, then becomes a heartless and Nobody , which is a Dusk Nobody, then has its own experiences, gets defeated, and said Random Guy remembers what it was like as a nobody.

Edited October 19, 201510 yr by Steven Drake (SteVentus)

Luckily the Nobodies don't actually "Form" their own working heart that could make them into actual people. It is merely their memories that are stored inside the nobody until they are defeated as well as the heartless to become a single person once again. 

 

 

What? Who said the new heart wasn't or couldn't be a working heart? It's been said anything can grow a heart and that as soon as a body loses it's heart it will try to grow a new one if it has the proper nurturing circumstances to do so.  Yes it's made from the memories and experiences and emotions of that nobody but all hearts are made from those. Replacement or not. Based off Axel I think it's been shown their replacement hearts "work" pretty well.

I'm just glad That Nobodies can't have their own individual heartless and nobody. Otherwise it'd be way too hard to track down Xehanort that way.  

Yet...................cuz that's the only logical way to have 13 Xehanorts easily cuz not everyone is susceptable to the cloning process he did

 

But hey I'm sure Nomura will pull this out of his ass like he always do......where suddenly he uses that as an excuse to have both Lea and Axel at the same time..........even though Lea has aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaall of his memories of being Axel(which was like 90% of his life at this point) so really what's the point of calling him Lea anymore especially when everyone in the game is still calling him Axel

Yet...................cuz that's the only logical way to have 13 Xehanorts easily cuz not everyone is susceptable to the cloning process he did

 

But hey I'm sure Nomura will pull this out of his ass like he always do......where suddenly he uses that as an excuse to have both Lea and Axel at the same time..........even though Lea has aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaall of his memories of being Axel(which was like 90% of his life at this point) so really what's the point of calling him Lea anymore especially when everyone in the game is still calling him Axel

There would be no point to Nomura having Axel and Lea exist at the same time. At all.

 

And everyone's calling him Axel because they're used to calling him that, along with him repeatedly telling people to "Get it memorized", so they did. Now they have to memorize the name "Lea" or just stick to "Axel".

 

And the replacement Heart functions like a regular Heart, will merge with the Original upon reuniting and if the Heartless doesn't get slain, then they don't merge. They just live their lives separately until it happens someday, or until the Nobody ages to death. Beyond that, no one knows.

 

Nomura doesn't really pull that much out of his ass, to be honest. (Here's hoping that the Keyblade War was 1000's of years ago rather than 100. Then the mystery would be ill-founded.) And DDD was pretty damn good, story wise and gameplay wise. The Nobody Twist was damn good. Time Travel, not so much.

What? Who said the new heart wasn't or couldn't be a working heart? It's been said anything can grow a heart and that as soon as a body loses it's heart it will try to grow a new one if it has the proper nurturing circumstances to do so.  Yes it's made from the memories and experiences and emotions of that nobody but all hearts are made from those. Replacement or not. Based off Axel I think it's been shown their replacement hearts "work" pretty well.

Yet...................cuz that's the only logical way to have 13 Xehanorts easily cuz not everyone is susceptable to the cloning process he did But hey I'm sure Nomura will pull this out of his ass like he always do......where suddenly he uses that as an excuse to have both Lea and Axel at the same time..........even though Lea has aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaall of his memories of being Axel(which was like 90% of his life at this point) so really what's the point of calling him Lea anymore especially when everyone in the game is still calling him Axel

No not like broken hearts, I mean hearts that ARE real hearts. Like Axel's grown heart can't have his own Nobody like Lea had Axel, right? Like there hasn't been any nobodies who have nobodies of themselves, right? Like Xemnas doesn't have a nobody of himself? And Xigbar doesn't have a nobody of himself either? Dealing with the nobody of a nobody? I just don't see it happening. (Flaming Lea... Whai u contradict evury1's eenputs?)

No not like broken hearts, I mean hearts that ARE real hearts. Like Axel's grown heart can't have his own Nobody like Lea had Axel, right? Like there hasn't been any nobodies who have nobodies of themselves, right? Like Xemnas doesn't have a nobody of himself? And Xigbar doesn't have a nobody of himself either? Dealing with the nobody of a nobody? I just don't see it happening.(Flaming Lea... Whai u contradict evury1's eenputs?)

 

They are real hearts. And I doubt a nobody would form another heartless and especially a nobody bc said nobodies are made from the persons actual physical body and soul.( except Namine who was a complete and utter anomoly being from a PoH's heart ) They cannot keep replicating more body and souls just hearts.

 

Because I am discussing said subject and I know what I am talking about based off canon knowledge of what we do know.

They are real hearts. And I doubt a nobody would form another heartless and especially a nobody bc said nobodies are made from the persons actual physical body and soul.( except Namine who was a complete and utter anomoly being from a PoH's heart ) They cannot keep replicating more body and souls just hearts.

I'd really prefer it to be impossible, but basing myself to the current information it could be possible for a nobody who developed a heart to actually form another nobody and heartless.At this point there's something that botheres me, if said nobody who developed a heart, let's take Axel as an example, if he splitted himself in a new nobody and a new heartless who would the destruction of these new beings reform, Axel or Lea?this is so confusing and weird please tell me we have solid proof that this can't happen

I'd really prefer it to be impossible, but basing myself to the current information it could be possible for a nobody who developed a heart to actually form another nobody and heartless.At this point there's something that botheres me, if said nobody who developed a heart, let's take Axel as an example, if he splitted himself in a new nobody and a new heartless who would the destruction of these new beings reform, Axel or Lea?this is so confusing and weird please tell me we have solid proof that this can't happen

 

A nobody is someones leftover physical body and soul  after one loses their heart. There is not another body and soul lying around for this to happen unless Nomura decides to write some fantastic loophole.( which is why i said this is doubtful not impossible) That is indeed possible in itself and should scare anyone. 

Also to answer who it would reform i guess technically Axel? Because it was Axel's new heart that the nobody and heartless were based off? But yet Axel is still connected to his original heart so there's also that so even then i'm not sure lol. Let's just hope that does not happen to any character to speculate on.

First of all, no need for flipping off a nice game. Second, everything Flaming Lea has said so far pretty much explains everything. And if anything, it is likely that if a Nobody who grew a heart got destroyed, he would still fade away like all Nobodies would. I mean, the sheer fact that all the apprentices awoke in Radiant Garden without any clones of themselves running around are proof enough. Odds are they started forming new hearts over their 10 years of existence, so that means that they were destroyed, Nobody bodies, hearts, and all. Yet the fact that their Heartless halves were conveniently destroyed prior to their deaths (they were likely any of the many Heartless in KH1, there were a lot of them after all) shows that they had their original hearts to merge with. With that in mind, it can be said that their new hearts stayed within their bodies upon their destruction and fused with their original hearts upon their recompletion. Which makes sense, because as we've seen hearts are made out of the feelings, memories, and connections we have, and a Nobody experiences those too, so naturally becoming a whole person again would combine everything all together like two separate flash drives (or whatever more appropriate metaphor there is for this) into a single collective. So Lea is just as much of who he was as Axel, he just has his original heart (and lack of assassin tattoos) back. He is a summation of all of his past experiences as Lea and newer experiences growing up as Axel.

All this discussion has made me question something. Since Nobodies grow hearts, and when they are destroyed by a keyblade (as well as the heartless respectively being destroyed too), the original body and heart reunite. But, What happens to the NEW Heart the Nobody grew in it's time away from it's original Heart? Does it just merge with the person's original Heart as a culmination of the experiences and memories they had during their time as a Nobody? I don't think Nomura ever cleared this up.

Edited October 19, 201510 yr by Reyn

All this discussion has made me question something. Since Nobodies grow hearts, and when they are destroyed by a keyblade (as well as the heartless respectively being destroyed too), the original body and heart reunite. But, What happens to the NEW Heart the Nobody grew in it's time away from it's original Heart? Does it just merge with the person's original Heart as a culmination of the experiences and memories they had during their time as a Nobody? I don't think Nomura ever cleared this up.

 

Yes for all the reasons I've explained above in my first post. But it's not been officially confirmed by Nomura. Maybe in KH3 it will be clarified.

They are real hearts. And I doubt a nobody would form another heartless and especially a nobody bc said nobodies are made from the persons actual physical body and soul.( except Namine who was a complete and utter anomoly being from a PoH's heart ) They cannot keep replicating more body and souls just hearts.

 

Because I am discussing said subject and I know what I am talking about based off canon knowledge of what we do know.

And this is basically what I like about discussing KH with Flaming Lea ^_^

Honestly i think they are just changing things as they go along. Mostly in kh3d My guess is because they want a reason to bring roxas back without people getting angry haha.

Then..........what happens to the original heart that used to inhabit the body before it was casted away to become a heartless?

 

Since if I remember correctly,nobodies used to be the bodies left of said human who became a heartless(unless You're Sora or Xehanort in which case your nobody gets his own freaking body separately from you for some reason).........and according to Dream Drop Distance(f*** this game btw) nobodies can grow their own hearts

 

So then...........what happen to the dude who lost hisher body and became a heartless....all while their own nobody grow a heart of his own?Do they stay as a heartless forever or just die and see their bodies become basically the equivilant of a possessed corpse?

 

 

This confuses the shit outta me and it didn't occur to me how stupid it is until a let's player who's currently LPing Kingdom Hearts 2 talked about it.

A nobody obtains a burgeoning replacement that acts like a heart, but does not have all of the capabilities. It does have the power of retaining memory and has some emotions, but it is not a true heart. By the way, KH3D is a good title. Just because you get confused or it seems a little hard to understand doesn't make it a bad game.

A nobody obtains a burgeoning replacement that acts like a heart, but does not have all of the capabilities. It does have the power of retaining memory and has some emotions, but it is not a true heart. By the way, KH3D is a good title. Just because you get confused or it seems a little hard to understand doesn't make it a bad game.

 

They are real hearts growing. The body will try to replace what it's lost but that does not make a replacement heart not a true heart. Matter of fact DDD tells us otherwise. If Roxas, Namine, and Xion grew hearts ( and they did according to DDD) they are real and make them their own separate selves/identities. Like it's been said over and over - anything can grow a heart and never has it been said those hearts aren't real. They are made from real memories, emotions, and experiences just like original hearts.

They are real hearts growing. The body will try to replace what it's lost but that does not make a replacement heart not a true heart. Matter of fact DDD tells us otherwise. If Roxas, Namine, and Xion grew hearts ( and they did according to DDD) they are real and make them their own separate selves/identities. Like it's been said over and over - anything can grow a heart and never has it been said those hearts aren't real. They are made from real memories, emotions, and experiences just like original hearts.

I see. So then those are actual hearts then. I thought that it was not a true heart and merely something that is satisfactory enough for the time being until the real heart returns, but does not contain the whole package?

I see. So then those are actual hearts then. I thought that it was not a true heart and merely something that is satisfactory enough for the time being until the real heart returns, but does not contain the whole package?

 The body will try to replace what it's lost but has no guarantee it will ever be reunited with it's original heart.The nobody does keep a connection to it's heart though. Not all nobodies grow back replacement hearts- just ones that have the correct nurturing conditions to do so.

 The body will try to replace what it's lost but has no guarantee it will ever be reunited with it's original heart.The nobody does keep a connection to it's heart though. Not all nobodies grow back replacement hearts- just ones that have the correct nurturing conditions to do so.

Ah I see. I remember Xemnas saying so. So that means that members of Organization 13 that fit all the conditions became adequate to become a Xehanort then.

Ah I see. I remember Xemnas saying so. So that means that members of Organization 13 that fit all the conditions became adequate to become a Xehanort then.

 

 He needed them to throw away their identities/selves ( their hearts) and basically be an empty husk to put his heart/heart pieces into so he could take over them through his heart which would slowly consume the vessel. That's also why after they lost their hearts he gave them all new names with the X in them. Some members were good candidates for this - others not for various reasons Xemnas also listed in DDD. 

 He needed them to throw away their identities/selves ( their hearts) and basically be an empty husk to put his heart/heart pieces into so he could take over them through his heart which would slowly consume the vessel. That's also why after they lost their hearts he gave them all new names with the X in them. Some members were good candidates for this - others not for various reasons Xemnas also listed in DDD. 

I see. He wanted them to truly be nobodies who have no feeling and can't feel even though their heart is replaced. That is where they became vulnerable. So really, the Recusant's sigil is merely for those who disobey and turn against him, not a mark of heresy. Hence, why Sora was able to be tracked throughout his journey in the Realm of Sleep.