I've been thinking about a topic that has Been coming up in the KH community lately, that has to do with the game mechanics of KH3. We've all complained or thought how "slow" BBS and 3D has felt gameplay wise. What I mean is the lag in combos and dodges that you experience. What I'm getting at is I hope that KH3 won't be another broken game that you can just spam 1 OG move and dodge over and over again. KH2 have you a variety and a strategy to gaming. And I am scared that with the same team the worked on those handheld games, namely Osaka, will do the same to the next big installment. Bring the Tokyo Team back! We know they can make great KH games.

No. KH3 is using the KH1/KH2 gameplay, along with flowmotion from 3D, Attraction Flow, and Keyblade Transformations.

Nomoura did say that, yes, but still it's not the same team working on the project. That's what worries me. It's hard to replicate someone else's work

Nomoura did say that, yes, but still it's not the same team working on the project. That's what worries me. It's hard to replicate someone else's work

The Tokyo Team is helping with KH3.

The Tokyo Team is helping with KH3.

Let's just hope the Tokyo team adds they're two sense and fixes the lag problem

Let's just hope the Tokyo team adds they're two sense and fixes the lag problem

What lag problem?

You've seen the Gameplay Videos, correct? It's a similar combat system to KH1/KH2 with new mechanics.

 

Still fast. Still balanced. Still awesome.

 

You don't need to worry about a thing, lest Square be accused of False Advertising. Then they're in trouble.

You've seen the Gameplay Videos, correct? It's a similar combat system to KH1/KH2 with new mechanics. Still fast. Still balanced. Still awesome. You don't need to worry about a thing, lest Square be accused of False Advertising. Then they're in trouble.

Yes I have seen the new gameplay, and don't get me wrong it looks amazing. When 3D was coming out we all were saying the same thing, on how fast paced it looks. But yet it still had combos throughout the entire games had the same speed as early game in KH1. Its slow, it's boring and if it wasn't for flow motion and the command deck, I probably would've never finished the game. Idk I just have trust issues with the Osaka studio lol

Yes I have seen the new gameplay, and don't get me wrong it looks amazing.When 3D was coming out we all were saying the same thing, on how fast paced it looks. But yet it still had combos throughout the entire games had the same speed as early game in KH1. Its slow, it's boring and if it wasn't for flow motion and the command deck, I probably would've never finished the game. Idk I just have trust issues with the Osaka studio lol

What game did you play?

 

DDD was quite fast paced, actually. The slowest KH game by far is still KH1, followed by Days which....well, we don't talk about that.

 

Osaka isn't really that bad, you know. You want a bad game studio? Try Eutechnyx.

KH3 is the further evolution of the system that originated in KH then evolved in KH2. It has elements of KH3D and maybe BbS too. The keyblade transformations are its own thing.

What game did you play?  DDD was quite fast paced, actually. The slowest KH game by far is still KH1, followed by Days which....well, we don't talk about that. Osaka isn't really that bad, you know. You want a bad game studio? Try Eutechnyx.

Haha yeah it was alright. Maybe still my 3rd favorite game in the franchise. With KH2 at the Helm. I guess because of growing up playing KH2, and then when final mix came out with all the data battles, it was the perfect mix of fast paced and balanced when the enemy had weak points, but also was impossibly hard. And there was no set In stone way that was guaranteed to win. Sure there are strategys, but for example in BBS, when you fight the mysterious figure, you can just cartwheel your ass off and spam thunder surge and it's a guaranteed win. And same with the Julius battle in 3D. You just roll constantly and spam the Blallonra move over and over. I hope that they give the same feel in the boss battles in KH3. Where you have to think to defeat your opponent. Not just be on autopilot. And what's that studio? Never heard of it lol

No, it was confirmed more than a year ago that the gameplay was going to be in the same fashion as KH1 and KH2, it's just supposed to be more of an evolution from KH2's gameplay with influences and inspirations taken from the more previous games. Also, I don't get how anyone could call BbS and DDD's gameplay "slow" or "broken". Those games had PLENTY of speed in them. Yeah maybe you don't have those speedy flashy combos, but you still got insanely flashy moves, larger space, more mobility moves (just because you get one dodge move doesn't mean that you only have one way of getting around a stage...wait, you get MORE than one dodge move, what the heck are you talking about?), more dynamic action, and more urgency in your actions. Those things didn't take away any speed or dynamicism, they ADDED more. KH3 won't be using the Deck Commands if that's what you're wondering, but the game will still be taking some major influences from that game, such as the Flowmotion from DDD and the higher variety of moves and abilities from BbS as well as the Transformation ability (albeit to a greater extent than BbS did).

No, it was confirmed more than a year ago that the gameplay was going to be in the same fashion as KH1 and KH2, it's just supposed to be more of an evolution from KH2's gameplay with influences and inspirations taken from the more previous games. Also, I don't get how anyone could call BbS and DDD's gameplay "slow" or "broken". Those games had PLENTY of speed in them. Yeah maybe you don't have those speedy flashy combos, but you still got insanely flashy moves, larger space, more mobility moves (just because you get one dodge move doesn't mean that you only have one way of getting around a stage...wait, you get MORE than one dodge move, what the heck are you talking about?), more dynamic action, and more urgency in your actions. Those things didn't take away any speed or dynamicism, they ADDED more. KH3 won't be using the Deck Commands if that's what you're wondering, but the game will still be taking some major influences from that game, such as the Flowmotion from DDD and the higher variety of moves and abilities from BbS as well as the Transformation ability (albeit to a greater extent than BbS did).

I know nomoura said that. And believe me I trust them. I'm just stating the fact of how slow the combos are. I know that the games are still fast paced in there own right, but still compared to the best game in the franchise, aka KH2, its child's play. And I'm talking about the different dodges between the different characters, how Ven actually rolls, Aqua dodges, and Terra Slides. And even in 3D when Sora has more ass behind his roll when you upgrade it than Riku does. And I've experienced first hand when using Aqua that there is a split second delay in her cartwheel that leaves her wide open in boss battles. Especially in the HD remaster it's even worse. To prove it I actually timed each of the rolls in BBS. With Ven being th fastest and Aqua being the slowest. She's almost a full 1/2 of a second slower. And that can mean a lot when your about to die tbh.

Haha yeah it was alright. Maybe still my 3rd favorite game in the franchise. With KH2 at the Helm. I guess because of growing up playing KH2, and then when final mix came out with all the data battles, it was the perfect mix of fast paced and balanced when the enemy had weak points, but also was impossibly hard. And there was no set In stone way that was guaranteed to win. Sure there are strategys, but for example in BBS, when you fight the mysterious figure, you can just cartwheel your ass off and spam thunder surge and it's a guaranteed win. And same with the Julius battle in 3D. You just roll constantly and spam the Blallonra move over and over. I hope that they give the same feel in the boss battles in KH3. Where you have to think to defeat your opponent. Not just be on autopilot. And what's that studio? Never heard of it lol

Thunder Surge and Dodging does not equal a guaranteed win against Mysterious Figure/Young Xehanort.

 

Neither does Balloonra against Julius.

 

KH has always had strategy to it and the cheesing/cheap methods are often stupid and unsatisfying so why bother?

 

And Eutechnyx made Ride to Hell: Retribution....yeah.

 

No, it was confirmed more than a year ago that the gameplay was going to be in the same fashion as KH1 and KH2, it's just supposed to be more of an evolution from KH2's gameplay with influences and inspirations taken from the more previous games. Also, I don't get how anyone could call BbS and DDD's gameplay "slow" or "broken". Those games had PLENTY of speed in them. Yeah maybe you don't have those speedy flashy combos, but you still got insanely flashy moves, larger space, more mobility moves (just because you get one dodge move doesn't mean that you only have one way of getting around a stage...wait, you get MORE than one dodge move, what the heck are you talking about?), more dynamic action, and more urgency in your actions. Those things didn't take away any speed or dynamicism, they ADDED more. KH3 won't be using the Deck Commands if that's what you're wondering, but the game will still be taking some major influences from that game, such as the Flowmotion from DDD and the higher variety of moves and abilities from BbS as well as the Transformation ability (albeit to a greater extent than BbS did).

^^^All of this.

do you mean how in BBS and DDD your combos would rarely stagger enemies and you'd get interrupted during attacks. Compared to KH1 and KH2, BBS and DDD had inconsistent combat mechanics. It was worse in DDD because enemies could throw status ailments at you that only became a nuisance. If you got hit with a stun ailment you'd be stuck in place and enemies would just circle around you and attack like once or twice. quite irritating. 

Does this even need answering?

do you mean how in BBS and DDD your combos would rarely stagger enemies and you'd get interrupted during attacks. Compared to KH1 and KH2, BBS and DDD had inconsistent combat mechanics. It was worse in DDD because enemies could throw status ailments at you that only became a nuisance. If you got hit with a stun ailment you'd be stuck in place and enemies would just circle around you and attack like once or twice. quite irritating.

Yes that's also another point. Although KH2 staggering could be excessive at times, square didn't have to remove it completely. I understand maybe toning it down, but there is absolutely no sign of any flinching in any enemies. That does make things real aggravating.

I hated DDD and BBS's battle system I'm so glad their going back to the original style.

No, it was confirmed more than a year ago that the gameplay was going to be in the same fashion as KH1 and KH2, it's just supposed to be more of an evolution from KH2's gameplay with influences and inspirations taken from the more previous games. Also, I don't get how anyone could call BbS and DDD's gameplay "slow" or "broken". Those games had PLENTY of speed in them. Yeah maybe you don't have those speedy flashy combos, but you still got insanely flashy moves, larger space, more mobility moves (just because you get one dodge move doesn't mean that you only have one way of getting around a stage...wait, you get MORE than one dodge move, what the heck are you talking about?), more dynamic action, and more urgency in your actions. Those things didn't take away any speed or dynamicism, they ADDED more. KH3 won't be using the Deck Commands if that's what you're wondering, but the game will still be taking some major influences from that game, such as the Flowmotion from DDD and the higher variety of moves and abilities from BbS as well as the Transformation ability (albeit to a greater extent than BbS did).

 

Excuse but how can you call a game that has a essential move in it which makes you invincible against everything not broken? In BBS you dont need any strats for optional bosses like MF or No Heart, all you need to do is pressing square to be invincible and using thunder surges when the boss is open for attack. Of course you can use many different ways to fight the optional bosses but those wont be as effective as the invincibility roll and thunder surge spam in critical mode. And those speedy flashy combos you are talking about actually had some deeper use unlike in BBS. They will most likely take what they learned from the unbalanced chaos BBS and DDD for KH3 but i really hope they wont screw it up by giving us another square mashing/Balloon simulator.

Edited October 30, 20159 yr by EndOfTheWorld

I know nomoura said that. And believe me I trust them. I'm just stating the fact of how slow the combos are. I know that the games are still fast paced in there own right, but still compared to the best game in the franchise, aka KH2, its child's play. And I'm talking about the different dodges between the different characters, how Ven actually rolls, Aqua dodges, and Terra Slides. And even in 3D when Sora has more ass behind his roll when you upgrade it than Riku does. And I've experienced first hand when using Aqua that there is a split second delay in her cartwheel that leaves her wide open in boss battles. Especially in the HD remaster it's even worse. To prove it I actually timed each of the rolls in BBS. With Ven being th fastest and Aqua being the slowest. She's almost a full 1/2 of a second slower. And that can mean a lot when your about to die tbh.

 

 

Excuse but how can you call a game that has a essential move in it which makes you invincible against everything not broken? In BBS you dont need any strats for optional bosses like MF or No Heart, all you need to do is pressing square to be invincible and using thunder surges when the boss is open for attack. Of course you can use many different ways to fight the optional bosses but those wont be as effective as the invincibility roll and thunder surge spam in critical mode. And those speedy flashy combos you are talking about actually had some deeper use unlike in BBS. They will most likely take what they learned from the unbalanced chaos BBS and DDD for KH3 but i really hope they wont screw it up by giving us another square mashing/Balloon simulator.

 

Ok look, if you honestly care about all that stuff so much, then fine, good for you, you won't have to put up with all of that stuff in KH3. But I will say that it's a shame that you're letting all of that ruin for yourselves what is a really fun experience between the two games. Faster combos are nice and fun, but I crave more variety than that sometimes, and BbS and DDD provided that for me. I honestly don't care that much about "Ooohhh look how many/little invincibility frames are in this move" or "Uggghghhnnnn I can't believe I have to keep pressing the SAME BUTTON over and over and over again" or any little nit-picks like that, which let's be honest here, that's exactly what those are. I have my own little nit-picks too when it comes to those games, but they're mostly graphical so they aren't relevant at all, and also, they don't really matter in the grand scheme of things. Why? Because the games are fun and I enjoy them. If they were really that "unorganized" or "broken" then I don't think I or anyone else would really love them that much. When you get down to it it's just a matter of taste. Maybe those games aren't your guys' cup of tea, I get it. I think KH2 was a pretty high point of the series too, but I also think some of the games that came after really improved and built upon some of the ideas that KH2 started. It's like trying to look at a basket full of cherries and saying "yeah this cherry is red, but these cherries are even MORE red". It's a basket of cherries, if you love cherries then you aren't really going to care which one looks better, you just eat them and enjoy them or put them on a sundae or whatever you want to do with them. If you guys just don't care for those little kinds of issues, that's fine for you, me I honestly don't care as long as I can play in an interesting manner. The way the game is played is determined by two things: how the game is made and how you put your own style into how you play. If you try to play in a streamlined beat this boss as efficiently and quickly as possible while taking the least amount of damage sort of way, then maybe those issues will become more apparent. Me, I play to make more a cinematic experience, take a few hits only to heal myself for a comeback attack, let the enemy display all their moves, activate every possible reaction command, etc., turn the battle into an episode of Dragon Ball Z rather than a "hit this guy 8 times and he's dead" thing. Each style works depending on who you are and how you play. You guys play one way and you care about those issues, I play a different way and those don't matter to me as much. So that's how I could call a game not broken, because nothing in it gameplay-wise totally ruins my experience with it. And I hope that no matter what issues one game had or didn't have (KH2 is no saint either), KH3 takes the best of EVERY game and combines it into a way that truly feels like the culmination of the last 13+ years of fun that we've had, no matter how it was played, for a truly epic experience that everyone (or at least most of everyone) can feel satisfied with.